Good evening.
I'd like to call the order regular meeting
of the zoning Board of Appeals on Wednesday,
April 23rd at 7:30 PM Please
rise for the Pledge of Allegiance.
I pledge. Pledge allegiance to the flag
of the United States of America,
and to the republic for which it stands,
one nation under God, indivisible
for liberty and justice for all.
This Brings us to roll call
Mr. Svi.
Present Mr. Green? Here.
Mr. Perry. Present. Mr. Lindsey? Present. Mr. Cliff?
Present. Mr. Watts? Here. Mr. Assessor present.
Mr. Jersey's present. Chairman Sia, present
The full board.
This brings us to the adoption of the agenda.
I don't think there's any changes tonight.
No, there's no changes. Mr.
Chair, I'd like to, uh, make a motion
to adapt the agenda as written.
Support. Support.
We have a motion by Secretary Jersey that was support
by Mr. Lindsay.
Mr. Green. I'm sorry. I believe it was Mr. Green though.
Lemme ask. Okay.
Hi, Mr. Green to approve, uh, the agenda tonight.
All in favor? Aye. The agenda has been approved.
This brings us, uh, to the approval
of the regular meeting minutes of March 12th.
I don't recall if those have gone out yet. I don't
Recall 'em going out Yet.
I don't, I don't believe they have.
No, I don't. Seeing those Don't oversee them either.
We have a motion to postpone.
Make a motion to table.
I'll support. We have a, I'm sorry.
We have a motion by Mr. Cliff. Support by Mr.
Norwood. Yep. To, uh, to table the approval of the meeting.
Minutes of March 12th. All in favor? A.
Aye. The meeting minutes
of March 12th have been tabled.
And now we have the approval of the April 9th minutes.
Those haven't gone out either.
Can we get a motion to our motion
To, uh, April those till next
Meeting. Support.
We have a motion by Mr. Neitz. Support by Mr. Green.
I'm sorry. I'm having trouble hearing tonight. Mr. Green.
Mr. Green, uh, to a table
of the April 9th approval of the minutes.
All in favor? Aye. Aye.
The April 9th minutes have been table.
This brings us to item six.
Item six, applicant Wu Khanna, um,
representative Wabu Khanna.
Common description, 3 0 8 2 3 Bowie,
your has requested permission
to retain Widen driveway 12 feet beyond edge
of garage in the front yard.
My name is Ana,
my resident at 3 0 8 2 3 Bowie Drive.
Thank you. Please tell us about your request.
Respected members of the board.
Thank you for your time and your
willingness to hear me this evening.
Now, here in front of us is another annoying
agenda request widening the driveway,
but I kindly ask of you to look at it,
the true reason I'm asking for this.
And, uh, and I'm gonna explain to you right now.
And basically I purchased a, a, a quick brief, uh,
background on this.
I purchased my house on, uh, 2014,
and I've been living there for 11 years.
And, uh, shortly thereafter, within a year
or two, I noticed, uh, unusual flow of traffic.
So basically what I've done is I've looked into it to see
what was going on and talked to a few neighbors.
And then we found out is basically I found out from the
papers I'm presenting to you, it shows I,
my house sits like exactly on a 90 degree radius on Bowie
Drive that meets Chene and Bowie Drive.
And that exits bow.
Uh, my house sits nine houses south of 13 mile.
So south of me, there is about, uh, three quarter of a mile
of residence, uh, that live there.
And the only exit way out to that is going onto one exit
that is on Anos that goes out to 13 mile.
So the biggest problem in my hardship that I, uh,
run into is after living there 11 years, is basically
some people figured out a shortcut.
There's a lot of about 20 to 30% in the morning times
where they're going to work.
And in the afternoons evening when they're coming back
to work, not let alone on a school pickup days,
which is winter times, whenever, whatever the school time.
And we have right around my house, a drop off
and a pickup with a big, long extended school buses.
And on top of that, on a Fridays
where there's a waste truck pickup, it's a chaos there.
So I, my driveway is only 10 feet.
And, uh, I have my, uh, retired dad, uh, dad,
his, his car, we got it.
And, and he doesn't drive much
as his car is in the, in the garage.
And I have, I have two vehicles,
and if I park any one of those next to each other,
I can't even get out of the driveway door over there.
But my issue, my agenda really presents a significant,
uh, safety issue.
Now through my 11 years being living there in 11 years,
three times my car that I parked in front
of the house was sides swept.
So I lived with it, it's fine.
And one other, other time, three incidents.
The third incident, uh, like two years ago,
driver's side mirror broken.
So I decide to give up that, I gave up that,
and I said, I'm just gonna park in the driveway.
And really, I didn't, you know this,
if I knew this at the very beginning,
and it's my fault, of course, if I knew
that I was buying a home here, that it's gonna be
with this kind of little issue trouble,
I would've bought another house in Warren
that doesn't have the situation.
But I really didn't realize I love my home.
My home is, is beautiful, kept everything,
but I did 1, 1, 1 mistake of mine was
because of my ignorant.
And I know ignorant does not excuse me from anything.
But, you know, I do my walking
because doctor recommends I walk
like maybe three times a week.
And I've been doing that for about four or five years.
I ran into somebody that was doing a driveway in the, uh,
in my subdivisions there.
And I asked the fellow, he came over,
I saw his job that he did.
He did a beautiful job.
And then in this one, he did a beautiful job too.
But like I said, again, this is my fault.
If I knew that I had to come in front of a board
and do this, I run, probably, in all honesty,
I would've chose the path of, in 11 years this summer,
I would be ready to sell my house
and just find me a different home.
But now with this economic situations we are in,
it's not even appropriate.
I, I, I bought it in 2014, you know, so,
so this is, this is my biggest trouble.
But if you see on the pictures that I showed you there,
I try to do the best I can on those things.
You know, I presented 16 copies and it's got pictures
and it's got highlight how the people would do that.
And you know, it's not against the law that they're doing
that, but there is no signs.
There is no nothing. As a matter of fact,
one time we thought maybe to ask the city
to put some speed bumper bumpers,
because when they come in that radius, they don't come slow.
They don't come five miles an hour.
They come higher than that. But that's my agenda.
So whatever you decide, I really appreciate it.
But my biggest mistake that I went and invested into this,
and that's my fault, truly my only fault.
And I wish I have not done that
because I would've rather moved into a different home.
And I thank you for listening to me.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone in the audience,
but we have a, uh,
letter from the neighbor that we'll read into the record.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, this, this from Emily
and Jeffrey Bowman, who reside at 4 7 0 2 Lash Shane.
Yeah. Um, they're writing to express report
for the zoning variance, which requested by Mr.
Yana at 3 0 8 2 3 Bowie Bowie Road in Warren as neighbors.
We have no issue with the modification of his property
and hope that the city will grant his request.
Thank you. At this time, I'll close the public portion
of the meeting and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair. I have a couple. Mr.
I have a question for the petitioner.
Um, so you didn't check into this before you paved, right?
You know, this was my ignorance, my fault.
I admit this was my fault, and I wish I would've known that
because I would've never,
I would ne I wouldn't be standing here today. Okay?
So, But I paid for it
For, I'm looking at some pictures here.
Yes. And I see three commercial vehicles
parked across the front of your house.
In front of my house. Yes.
I see three white vans
parked across the front of your house.
This was one incident in the middle
of January when we had a lot of snow.
A friend of mine was remodeling his home.
And those two vans, he says,
can you keep 'em there for me for a couple weeks?
And that never, never ever happened. Sir,
Sir, these dates, these
pictures are dated March the fifth.
Yeah. So March the fifth. Yeah.
Listen, if you, if you did this in my neighborhood,
I'd be extremely upset.
I agree. We don't run, we don't.
It looks like you're running a business outta your house.
No, no, no. I really don't. Honestly, honestly, sir.
But let me explain one thing.
It was there for one week and,
and you know, this driveway, not
that it's excusing anything.
It's been there for like, about almost a year and a half.
No one complained. It was only that one incident
that I know now and learned is never gonna happen.
I'm not gonna do a favor to nobody
because I did this for me.
But I agree with you. I wouldn't want anybody,
I'm not running any business out of there.
I've been living there for 11 years
and my house is well kept.
Very good. Uh, uh, curb appearance. And that is true though.
That is, that is one incident only.
Otherwise they would've complaint on me.
I've been this, this there has been there a year, year,
almost a year and, and six months.
But, you know, I see these pictures, Uhhuh.
I see how much concrete you've had.
And with the pictures, it looks like you're turning your
front yard in the parking lot.
My front yard. Well, yeah.
It, it only gonna take, it's only gonna take three, uh,
vehicles, not vans.
One is my work van that's unmarked. Unmarked.
And I always keep it in inside, uh, the driveway.
I have two, two, uh, two vehicles.
One is a pickup and one is a, uh, a four door sedan.
And I gave up my parking spot in the front.
I agree that would, that situation,
there is never gonna happen where it's gonna be three vans.
That was one incident. And I should have, you know,
I guess just being, being nice and I did that,
but I'm not running no business out of there.
And I, I've been there 11 years.
No one ever, ever complained.
Look, looking at the picture, sir.
Yeah, you've done it for a while
because the grass is all beat down to mud between the curb
and the sidewalk where you're coming
crossways to get your vehicle in there.
I thought, I thought that was in, in, in, in January,
but I'm mistaken maybe on the date.
But yes, whenever they took that picture, that was the time.
That was one week. That was one week. So I agree with you.
I agree with you. You have a point.
I wouldn't like it, but it was a one time thing.
It's never gonna happen. If it ever happens,
it's never gonna happen because I don't need a complaint.
I have good relationship with all my neighbors, you know,
you know, my three neighbors on my side, on my side,
on one side and on my south and no, uh, and north side.
I mean, my neighbors maybe in the front.
One of them did that. You mentioned the address. I agree.
You know, but it was one time incident.
One week, one week only. Mr. Chair, Ms. Mr.
ACOs me. This actually
The cost, answer your question.
Uh, Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Secretary Jersey on
The floor. Um,
so the way I see it, you know,
picture's worth a thousand words.
Yeah. Um, and please don't interrupt if I'm speaking, sir.
Um, so it does look like
you're running a business outta your house.
Um, to, to get, to get a variance.
Granted, you gotta meet five, five different requirements.
To me, I don't feel that this is a necessary, a necessary
thing for that property.
First off, you have a two car garage,
which is only occupied it seems like by one vehicle.
You claim to have two vehicles for the property where three
or four commercial vehicles just popped up.
I don't feel the traffic flow on Bowie
is to the, the, the point to where you need
four car wide driveway in the front.
Um, granted, I'll give you the argument between the ingress
and egress out of that neighborhood.
You only have one way and one way out. Okay?
But to have two vehicles, you claim for your property,
you have a two car garage, you a normal driveway, 10 foot,
you can put one, two cars in there.
So I, I don't see how this is necessary
for that property.
And it is a complete detriment because it is not necessary.
So that's my argument.
Um, and that's the way I see it. And I'll yield the floor.
I would just like to add the,
the home is a very attractive looking home.
It blows my mind that you would want to park
vehicles in the front yard.
I don't have a problem with people wanting
to extend their driveway, you know, maybe four feet,
six feet, just enough where you can have two cars in the
driveway and in the wintertime you can open car doors
where you're not on the, on the lawn.
But this just seems excessive.
It, it seems like it's your whole front yard.
Are there other comments on the board,
Mr. Chair,
Give the floor. If,
If I may, this is a pretty good example for the board
of a kind of a dilemma.
We have. So we have ordinances in place that restrict
and tell the residents what the restrictions are.
But as a community changes, there seems to be a,
and I, when I drive around, I, I'm seeing it more
and more now that I've been, uh, it's been brought
to my attention, is that people
are paving their front yards.
I mean, if you start looking, they're there.
And a lot of times it's for two reasons.
One is, uh, an economic reason to save money
and run a business out of their home.
And I'm not implying that you do.
The second one is, we have, uh, areas now
where we have multiple families living in homes.
And it, and it, it, it becomes a, a convenience
for those people to have, uh, more places to park.
So we have two choices.
One is to, you know, uh, go by what the ordinance says,
or the other one is to change the ordinance.
So because of that, I, I wanna vote no on it tonight too.
For the same reason. It doesn't meet the hardship standards.
It's the property can be used as zoned.
It's not a unique property by any stretch of imagination.
It doesn't create an economic hardship for you.
And I don't, I don't think it's necessary. Thank
You. Thank you Mr. Green.
Mr. Chair. Mr.
Sitz. I just wanted to reiterate my agreement
with the previous comments
because, you know, looking at that road, Bowie,
it's no more busier than most other roads in the city.
I know that my house, we have three cars.
One's in the garage, one's on the driveway,
the third one's on the street.
You know how many times they've seen cars coming down my
street, way over the speed limit I'm sure of.
But you know, it's like they, a house with two car garage,
two car driveway, and a spot in front of the house.
You can easily park. Yeah,
you could park five cars there without having to enlarge
and pave the front yard.
And by paving almost half the front yard, I mean,
that's turning into a parking lot.
And not to mention the detriment of
the curb being Oh yeah, the standard size
and having it that wide over just inherently you're driving
over the corner of the, of the lawn. Mm-hmm.
Exactly. The one, Mr.
Chair, the one thing I also wanna bring
to the board's attention too, you know,
with the master plan, we're always looking
for added green space in this, in this town.
And, you know, your lawn is green.
Space is considered green space.
So, you know,
when we're making these decisions, we kinda have to take that.
Also consideration too, with the master plan.
You know, how much of this do we grant?
How much do we not grant based off, off of that as well.
So, um, so I just wanted to throw that 2 cents in
to, to, to the argument.
Thank you. Any further discussion or possible motions
Prepared?
I'm prepared to make a motion, so work
with me on my first one here.
Please do so.
I would make a motion to deny retaining a widened driveway,
12 foot beyond edge of the garage in the front yard.
Um, I also feel it's a detriment
to the neighborhood as well.
Support. We have a motion by Mr. Watts, support
by Mr. Perry to deny the petitioner's request.
Mr. Watts? Yes.
Aye. A yes vote is to Deny. Yes. To deny
Mr. Perry Yes.
To deny Mr. Cliff?
Yes. To deny
Mr. Assessor?
Yes. To deny Mr. Lindsay Yes. To deny Mr. Green? Yes.
To deny Mr. Starch?
Yes. To deny Mr. Jersey votes? Yes.
To deny Chairman Sefa.
Yes. To deny. Unfortunately, your request has been denied.
Thank you. Thank you.
This brings us to item seven.
Item seven. Applicant. MMC real estate investment.
LLC, representative Karen Birdie.
Common description 2 8 6 6 1.
Van D**e variance has requested permission
to one construct a eight foot precast concrete wall along
the west property line to operate two shifts.
Good evening. Good.
Too close. There you go. You're on now.
Okay, Karen Birdie on behalf
of MMC real estate investments.
Um, this item was
And your address please?
Pardon me? Your address, please? Yes.
Three one, um, 2 8 2 2 5 Mound Road, Warren, Michigan.
4 8 0 9 2. Thank you.
Um, this is an item that had previously been tabled.
I'm not going to bore you with the whole presentation,
but I do wanna remind you that this is a manufacturing
facility that was built in the forties.
Um, the houses surrounding it, many
of them were built in the forties.
It was prior to the city
actually having their zoning ordinance in place.
And obviously good planning wasn't in place in the forties
in the township of Warren as we were, um,
placing houses next to, um, manufacturing facilities.
But at this point, it's neither the residence's fault
or, um, the builder of the manufacturing facility
that we're now in this position.
But we need to find a way, hopefully to solve it
and to, um, coexist, um, peacefully
and where everybody can enjoy their property.
We wanna thank you for the adjournment.
We did use it, uh, to our, uh, uh, expeditiously
during that time period.
We did do a review internally of our facility.
We did find some, um, vents and fans
and things that we could repair.
Those have been repaired.
We, um, actually I contacted Rete, the company
that we're proposing to use.
And, um, we are asking to use this company.
And the reason we're asking
to use this company is this is the company that,
that is used along expressways.
They have, if you will, a texture on the wall
that helps absorb sound.
They are solid concrete, not brick block
that has the hollow areas.
Um, and we are confident that with this company, um,
we can have success in, uh, trying to dampen
and contain, uh, noise.
Um, I will say this, this company, there have been other
situations such as ours in the city, two of them
that I've been told about where this company was used
to build, um, a barrier and it was successful.
So we'd like to try to absolutely use this company
because we think that's our best chance for success.
We also analyzed if there was anything else that we could do
to help with the noise dampening.
And
This is Van D**e.
This is our facility.
This is the borderline between the residences.
As you recall, we're proposing an eight foot wall,
but we'd also like to add arbor
all along the wall.
Um, when we put it in, we think
that the arborvitaes will help absorb, if you will sound,
and we'll also assist the wall in absorbing sound.
We are asking for two feet higher on the wall as we think
that that will also assist.
When we were here last, the concern was that
what if this didn't work?
And one of the, uh, suggestions
that was coming from the board was if my client were
to put up the wall, and obviously now we want
to add putting in the arbor ites,
although I don't think we need a variance for that.
But we're thinking about we wanna plant the arbor ites
to help with this.
And then having a time period to see if it's successful.
We would like to take a advantage of that.
We would agree to that condition that
this would be reviewable and I would propose a year
after being installed.
I would say this, normally when you go
before the ZBA, you get several years to comply.
We don't think that that in this situation is doable.
We need to be faster than that.
Our goal, if we were granted to be able to put up the wall
and the extra two feet, would be
that it goes in this spring or summer.
We don't have control necessarily over the company's, um,
timetable, but we would be willing to guarantee
that we would have the wall in with the extra two feet
by the end of October, for sure, sooner if we can do it.
If, if we can get them to come in in May or June.
That's what we'd like to do.
And then we'd like to, um, agree to give us,
I, like I said, I propose a year to see if it's effective.
We agree to it like a review date where it's addressed
and, um, we can see if in fact, um,
this has, uh, worked.
In the meantime, as you recall,
we employ 60 employees, uh, approximately, you know, give
or take 60 employees.
And my client is the only manufacturer of, of a shield
for lithium batteries that are in all GM electric vehicles.
They're the sole provider of that product.
We'd like to continue our two shifts during the period, um,
when we've ins when we install the wall
and see if this works on the review date.
If we have not been successful, then um,
that would be on the table that it be,
um, restricted.
So that's what we're proposing.
We think that it's the best compromise we can do.
Um, as I said, um, we've looked at many different options
and things that we can do
and this is what we've come up with
that we think is gonna be successful.
So if you have any questions, I'm available to answer.
Thank you. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Good evening. If you could just
start with your name and address please.
Hi, good evening. My name's Hassan Muss.
Manny, I live at 7 4 8 1 Gerald Avenue.
I'm about two houses from the factory.
Uh, I was here last time. I've sent you guys some emails.
Uh, we adjourned this for what, a month and a half.
'cause somebody was here. They were gonna look into
dampening the sound better.
They said they fixed some vents
and they're thinking about putting some shrubs in.
So I don't know what they looked into.
Uh, a couple facts of the matter.
They were up here a month and a half ago,
said they don't operate on the weekends.
They've been operating on the weekends since,
at least last spring.
Uh, I don't understand how he could lie to you about that.
They're not supposed to operate past seven right now.
It's supposed to be seven to seven operating.
They've been doing it the whole time.
They had the police come out,
they've been in litigation with the city.
He's already not listening about that.
So we've been dealing with that, him breaking the law
or whatever the zoning, uh, rules.
We've already been dealing with that.
So I think it was the secretary that proposed maybe two,
three months, build the wall.
We can come back here if we're happy
with the sound in our houses.
We have no problem with them
extending the time and the hours.
But right now, I mean,
we couldn't have a barbecue last night.
We want, it was 7:38 PM I was barbecuing.
Oh, let's eat outside.
We couldn't because the factory was so loud, we had to go
inside and then you can still hear it.
A couple weeks ago, I had some pots in my house
that were hanging, banging together
as you hear the stamping plant going.
So I had to go in my kitchen and separate the pots.
I just don't think it's fair that we would have to wait
for a year and then come back
and say, well, we can still hear it in our houses.
It would be easier if it was two, three months.
And we come back and say, we're happy with how it is.
We're more than happy to extend the time.
I think that's a compromise that I know I'm willing to do.
My fiance's willing to compromise on that.
We've already been compromising, dealing with him,
breaking the rules the whole time.
So I just think that this needs to be fixed
and I can't imagine hearing this another summer.
Thank you very much for your time.
Thank you for those comments.
This is a public hearing. Good evening.
Hi, good evening. I'm Rose Cannon. I live at 7 4 6 3.
Gerald, I'm actually four houses, um, from the factory.
And I just wanted to say I agree.
Um, what was just presented,
I don't know what's different now than was
presented at the last meeting.
Um, I was under the impression that the plan was for them
to consult with, uh, a some company that
had other ideas about how to manage the noise.
And that's why we postponed the decision
because they were gonna consult with them
and then come back with a new plan.
I'm not really hearing anything new, so, um, maybe
that can be clarified,
but, um, I'm in agreement that I don't think we should
make a decision about a second shift if we don't know
what the noise and the impact is gonna be like.
So if we could stick with one shift, put the wall up, see
how it goes, and then make a decision at that point, um,
that would work for me.
So thank you.
Thank you. Is there anyone else in
the audience that would like to speak?
I just want, I just wanted to confirm.
I sent an email last week.
The front of the building is literally crumbling into the
sidewalk and their window seals on Gerald Avenue
have also fallen off.
I sent an email to the same person I emailed when I emailed
you guys a couple months ago,
and I said in the email I wanted to show that
he's not even willing to clean up around his building
or is falling apart building.
I have the pictures right here still.
I mean, you can see from a distance plain as day
that the building is falling apart.
Right on the Van D**e,
the building department went there two days ago.
I spoke with him, he's sending something,
but this has been like this for three months.
I mean, the guy, he, they don't care about the residents.
They don't care about the community.
And I can send this email again,
I'm more than happy to with the pictures. Thank you again.
Thank you. Is there anyone else in the audience
who would like to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I close
the public portion of the meeting.
I would like to turn it over to Secretary Jersey to, uh,
review the planning impact statement.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, for Mr.
Wirth at the planning department, um,
after reviewing the request issues were found to
impact the abutting local and general public.
The plain department makes the following recommendations
regarding the proposed wall.
The wall shall be constructed
of eight feet high brick embossed poured concrete
with a 45 degree ca angle cap masonry block.
And precast concrete shall not be used
as construction material
to preserve the setbacks along Anna and Gerald avenues.
The wall shall begin 25 feet south of the northwest corner
of lot 56 continuing south along the west line of lot 56
for 119 feet, then continuing east along the south line
of lot 56 for 40 feet, then south along the west line
of lot 76 for 119 feet ending 25 feet north
of the southwest corner of lot 76
is indicated in the application
that the petitioner is requesting a variance for two shifts.
The proposed hours of these shifts should be
specified by the petitioner.
The current hours allowed under the zoning ordinance are se
are 7:00 AM to 7:00 PM.
Um, During the review, during the review
of this variance request, open storage
and materials was observed on the site
and the areas designated for vehicle parking.
The petitioner does not currently have site plan approval
for open storage on this property.
Therefore, the petitioner shall be required to apply
for site plan approval through the planning commission
to bring the site into compliance.
Thank you. At this time, I'll turn it over
to the board for discussion.
Uh, Mr. Chair, Mr. Green,
Ms. Birdie,
the, so I think in my brain, we're,
we're working at this backwards, we're dealing
with the sound after the sound's made.
So in the ordinance by
17.02 HI think it is.
And we, you there was some discussion,
and maybe you can help clarify this for me.
It appears by ordinance that these shock, these machines,
stamping machines, I'm gonna use the right,
correct terminology or it, it,
and the ordinance is specific.
It says they have to be on shock, absorb,
absorbing mountings,
and there has to be suitable, reinforced concrete flooring.
And no, no machine shall be loaded beyond the capacity
as prescribed by the manufacturer.
So in our previous dis uh, backup, there was some indication
that that was something that they were looking into.
It, it, it surprises me that if it is an ordinance,
why wasn't it done in the first place?
So originally, um, Mr. Murphy of the building department,
um, indicated that there was a problem
with the shock absorbers, et cetera.
We provided him with the information.
He came into the facility,
he inspected we have the proper shock absorbers
and support for that, um, machine.
He is now satisfied that it is in compliance.
So he's satisfied that these machines comply
with the ordinance in the city of Warren?
No. That the, the part that you discussed,
the shock absorbers
and the reinforced concrete,
these machines are in compliance.
He had originally questioned, um, my client on that.
My client gave him the documentation for that
and invited him in to inspect.
He looked at the, at, at what was there
and indicated that they do have the proper shock absorber
and reinforced concrete.
Okay. Make clear, I may interject any idea what
time period that inspection may have taken place?
Uh, that would've been, uh,
that would've been probably, uh, approximately a year ago.
Okay. And if you could state your name
and address since you spoke, please. Uh,
Ryan Herndon, owner of MMC, uh,
address is 2 8 6 6 1 Van D**e Avenue in Warren.
Thank you. I'm just trying to locate
that in the enforcement file here.
Yes, that's,
Can I address one other thing
about the front of the building?
I'll allow it. That was a car accident
and that has gone through insurance
and is now ready to be, um, repaired.
The implication in the statements
that we just don't care isn't really fair.
You can't, um, if you will,
without the insurance having inspected it, seen it and,
and them adjusting it, uh, change the front
and make the repairs.
You have to go through the insurance
Company. When was was the
accident the damage to the building?
Approximately a month ago. Okay.
Within two days we had estimates and
Okay. That's, that's
reasonable. Um, I do have a question for Mr.
Pont. I'm sorry, Mr. Green, Mr. Watch Hunt.
You can hold off for a second. I had one more
question. You still the floor, Mr. Green?
So again, we're in, we're in the same dilemma.
Uh, he, the site plan in the outside storage is a problem
and it, and it hasn't been, uh, remedied yet.
So in my mind, until those things are remedied,
I'm not sure I can support this.
So with regard to the outside storage,
my client is having drawings made
To, I'm sorry to, I can't hear you Ms. Brady. Okay.
Should I speak closer? Yeah, throw something at me. Okay.
I'm sorry. So, um, my client is having drawings made
to present to the planning department.
Unfortunately, you have, you're at the mercy
of the architect who does the drawings.
We have contracted for those drawings to be done.
He through chem tech over in, um, east Point.
And in addition to that, he has retained me to help him get
that process through the planning department.
So there is no question that, that that has to be addressed
and that we're already getting the
drawings to be able to do that.
The only reason I ask is because in the backup it stated
that he can't function without storage.
And that's why we're getting the plans drawn.
We are absolutely getting the plans drawn.
With regard to the shifts.
I I have documentation that shows back to the 1980s.
Two shifts were run. I haven't been able
to go back farther than the 1980s,
but I've gotten back as far as the 1980s.
Two shifts have always been run at this plant.
When my client purchased this property,
two shifts were running by Center Line Tool and die.
We have a letter from Centerline Tool
and Die that they were running two shifts at this.
Um, so with regard to that, this is not a sinister thing
where my client buys this property and then goes rogue.
This is a situation where two shifts were being run.
He, um, uh, thought that he could run two shifts.
He's been running, um, two shifts, uh,
there since he purchased it quite some time ago. I mean,
22, 20 22.
So about three years. Well, Ms.
Birdie, I'm gonna hold your thought for a second.
Um, what we,
we've been up here two times talking about two shifts.
We have not heard a single hours
of operation of what these shifts are. He
He gave them last time, we'll give 'em again.
Yeah. So our hours of operation are Monday through Friday,
5:30 AM to 11:30 PM Uh,
to address the previous comment this year to date, uh,
we have only worked two Saturdays
and we have never worked two shifts on a Saturday.
And what hours were those? Uh, seven to 3:37 AM
To 3:30 PM And we have never once in the history
of my ownership there worked a second
shift Saturday. Beyond that, we
Do a short about Sunday, Uh, no Sundays.
So no Sundays ever. Uh,
If, if the two shifts aren't granted, I don't want there
to be any, if the two shifts aren't granted,
the only way he can meet his contracts
with GM is he will have to run Monday
through Sunday, seven to seven.
That's the only way he'll be able to make it.
The, the one thing I'm puzzled about this whole,
this whole project is how, I mean,
if you knew storage was gonna be an issue,
you knew you wanted to run a second shift.
You, you had one, you had,
you had the back parking lot to work with.
How come there's no site plan at that point?
This crept up on him. He was not.
How, how does this creep up on
You? I can ex when
he moved,
he was not the sole provider of this park.
He, he didn't have all these, uh, contracts with GM
that he had when he moved in.
He had, um, uh, a smaller, well, he's too big for
A space then Ms. Birdie. I
mean, it sounds like,
it sounds like he's currently too big for his space.
Actually, The way what you're, the way you're
describing it, I mean, 'cause if you're gonna run two shifts
and you still need your whole back of your parking lot
for mainly outdoor storage,
where are you gonna park these people?
That's the, I mean, we can't continue parking people up
and down the street that's impacting the neighborhood.
Understood. So when we purchase the facility,
it was a dirt, uh, and gravel throughout the entire back.
So we've paved over half of that
and then, you know, have ran, ran into an issue
where our customers didn't pick the parts up outside, which
caused the out, you know, the, the parking issue.
But if we can get this organized
and under control with a site plan
and some outdoor storage, you know, we can,
we can coexist here.
Um, you know, we have spent a lot of money on the building.
The previous owners, you know, recently made a comment
that the building looks better than
it ever did when they owned it.
You know, we are investing money.
The, the narrative that we are, uh, there.
Well, I'm not discrediting that sir at, at all.
You know, I'm not discrediting that at all,
but I'm just pointing out
the elephant in the room, you know?
Yes. So it's, um,
I I I mean I'll yield the floor after
That. I, I do just
wanna wrangle the board in here.
We are here for just the two items,
the concrete wall and the two shifts.
It sounds like they're gonna go through planning
for the open storage and they're likely gonna need
to come back for a variance for that.
So that's gonna be evaluated, you know, at a,
at a later time with different criteria.
Um, I, my question for Mr.
Eron, if he could approach, I think I know the answer
to this and it's gonna just kind of further put us
between a rock and a hard place.
There is several notes in the zoning enforcement file
where a zoning official comes out
to do an official decibel reading.
And to my knowledge here, I,
I haven't seen a decibel reading over the allowed level.
I see readings in 56 decibels, 72 at one time, 62.
But I, I'm not seeing what the decimal limit is
and if there's a different rating at different times.
Could you provide some insight?
Um, the, as far as the, I can't speak
as far as the inspections.
I wasn't out there and I don't
see what you're reading right now.
'cause I've been trying to read
through the inspection reports.
Um, the ordinance for
M1 properties is,
and I don't have my ordinance here either.
Um, I'll have to get back to you on that.
There is certain limits that are allowed.
Um, let me look at that on my phone.
I'll research it and get back to you on
what those limits are.
I was just curious because in the enforcement file when
the reading was taking place, it makes mention
of the number, for example, a reading of
where is it point, whatever it was, point 72.
I think that was the highest one I I've seen.
But then there's a note underneath,
underneath the allowed limit.
I was just curious how high it is the limit. I
I think it's 80.
It's, but I'm not high almost for M1. I'm not sure. Okay.
I I If you can have it, pull it up, can it in five minutes.
Okay, great. Can I piggyback real quick?
Mr. Green, you have the floor.
Mr. Wattson, what's mz Multiple zoning,
That zoning designation, Multiple zones.
So this property actually has M1 and R one P on it.
So that's what the MZ stands for, is it has two
or more zones on that property. Thank you.
Mr. Any other questions while I got research?
If, if there is a, a if 80 decibel is the, the limit,
I'd be curious if there's a different limit based on the,
on a cutoff time in the evening
or a weekend if, if, if the ordinance is that
Detailed. I don't believe there is,
but I will look at that
As well. Thank you
Mr. Chair.
Mr. Cliff, you have the floor.
So I spoke about, I spoke about the problem is an ambient
noise Listening to what the gentleman,
the homeowner said about his pan
banging together in his house.
You're dealing with a resonance issue, a vibration issue
that causes noises in other places, not necessarily
where they're emanating from, which is your plant.
It's traveling through the ground
and it's hitting something else
and it's causing a reaction somewhere.
I'm a little disappointed
after mentioning that,
that we didn't maybe bring in a resident expert
and have a resident study done on your property while it was
running at full bo bo in full bear to see just
what the effects are of that residence's noise
to adjoining properties. Apparently there is a problem.
I didn't even know there was an expert in,
in residence noise
Jump online, Ms. Birdie,
there's a number of 'em right here in Michigan
that being up front with you, deal with that kind of thing.
I wish you had given me
that information at the last hearing.
I would've followed through,
but at this point, I, I kind of alluded to it.
I didn't know there was a residence expert,
residence noise expert.
There's residence noise experts throughout the state.
There's several of them. And I won't be comfortable
supporting anything to do with any of this
until I get the viewer report from a resident expert when
they go and visit these neighbors
who are reporting the problems
and they do a resonance study.
And I think you're gonna be surprised to find that
the corrective action you are likely going to have to take
to, to resolve that is going
to be far greater than planning some arbor writings
and putting up a eight foot wall.
I will, I will say that when the door is down,
the neighbors have seemed to indicate in the past
that they're satisfied and that there isn't a noise problem.
So I wasn't thinking about,
and I don't even know if I'm using the right term when
you're saying resonance noise, not
Resonance noise. Res
resonance effect.
Okay. Resonance effect.
So my understanding was when the door was down,
that the resident felt that the noise was, uh, uh,
fine and manageable.
We understand that the wall and the extra two feet
and the arbor can do no harm, but only improve.
I'm not disputing that it's not gonna solve these people's
problems with pots and pans rattling on their shelves
or in their basement or in their crawl spaces.
Well, and that's why one of the reasons why we're asking
for putting in the wall, putting in the arbor
and then seeing how we do so
that we can even take more corrective action.
And I will say this, during this time period, we did, um,
uh, uh, look into other things within the plant.
This was not a time of just docile on this.
We looked into what we could do within the plant.
Had we done everything we could within the plant,
we found a couple things that we could fix. We talked, are
We working through an engineering firm
to identify all these deficiencies?
We had them. Are we working with an engineering firm
to identify these
Deficiencies in No, we have not hired an engineering firm,
but we do talk to experts in the different fields
with regard to the vents that we repaired with regard
to the installation that we installed
and things along those lines. So, um,
Experts who are experts who are doing this work for, for
The plant, the people who do the different
work. I mean, people who
See you bring an engineering expert in,
he doesn't profit from the work, he just finds the problems
and then you have to figure out how to solve them
or he makes recommendations.
You need a resident sound engineer
to resolve these people's problems.
I'll, I'll leave dollars to donuts on it.
I've been through this before.
I've got a little bit of experience.
I'm not an expert, but I have some
experience in resonance noise.
I had to address it in, in my line
of work in my previous life.
But that's what these people are experiencing.
It's not noise traveling through the air so much.
It's traveling through the ground,
his vibrations traveling through the ground.
It hits a pipe going into his house in his basement.
It's hitting his foundation and causing vibrations.
It's it resonances noise.
It's vibrations caused noise
and issues caused by vibrations that travel.
Your Honor, you may not even hear it at the, at the point
of origin, but you'll hear it away from the point
of origin when those waves travel through the gr you know,
when the waves travel through.
I just, I just don't think that this property was engineered
to be a stamping plant in, in the first place.
When, when you say you were running two shifts
there, what were they doing there?
Were they doing turning and machining
or were they running stamping machines?
They were a large tool
and d**e since the,
since the beginning it was Center Line Dye Engineering.
They ran presses up to 2000 tons. The presses Okay.
For body side dyes, our largest press
and the whole facility is a hundred tons. So, and
I understand it was there
before the homes were even built,
but you know, this, this, whatever,
whatever's going on there isn't working.
We, we went down this route
because the feedback that we received was
that when the garage door is lowered,
the sound is manageable,
they can't hear it, or it's minimal.
We can't keep the garage door shut
because it's our only point of ingress to the building
for shipping and receiving.
I understand. So the drac Crete was a solution to replicate
what they're seeing with the garage door at all times.
And it's not a, it's not a end all be all,
but it's a very large investment on the, the business
and having to go to one shift would be a
very large hardship.
So we compromise instead of leaving this open-ended
where a variance would follow the land, we are asking
that we just have an opportunity to put the wall in,
solicit feedback from the neighbors,
take additional corrective actions
and be back here in a year to address it.
And if at that point it hasn't solved it,
the wall's still in and the hours are
gone. I mean, I think that's very
Well again, sir, I'm, I'm not comfortable in voting yes
for any of this until I see a report
from a bonafide ance engineer
and what they recommend to be.
You may be surprised.
You may not have to go through as much as
what you think you're going through now.
I I I just, I just would like to see that
because that's how it worked out
with the other issue I dealt with.
We had, they had all these big plans and ideas
and they didn't have to do a quarter of them
and it didn't cost them as much money.
Not to say that that's going to be your case,
but I think it's worth a shot to make that investment
as opposed to me voting yes on something that is a maybe
and then I have to hear from these folks again in a year.
And then, and then what's the recourse?
It's not like we, we can make you take it out.
Well, well the wall's not gonna do any harm
if the wall stays.
The wall can only be a benefit.
The arbor ites can only be a benefit,
But your position is that the wall is gonna solve
the noise problem.
But it's a huge step if it takes, I understand 31,
it claims to take away 31 to 32 points off
of the detector.
That's if we're at 52, we take away 31 or 32. I understand.
But if you take That off, we're doing a good thing.
It's not gonna, it may not affect the residents noise
Here. Okay. So we install
it, let's say we get it installed
by August and we install it and we're running the two shifts
and we hear from the people
and they're saying, you know what?
This isn't working. Then we, we know we're coming back here.
Then at that point we need to take the next step.
And now you're telling us, uh, the step to take.
That would be the next step.
We would uh, find somebody who is an expert in this,
I don't know how you say renaissance noise,
residence re residence noise effect residence,
residence effect.
Because he wants to be able
to continue doing his business there
because his only other option is he's got 60 employees now.
He's gonna have to let some of them go
and he's gonna have to go to Monday
through Sunday, seven to seven.
That's what he's gonna have to do if he can't solve this.
So it isn't in his best interest to solve this.
I personally believe it's in his best interest
to consult a residence engineer and move forward from there.
And I hear you, but I didn't understand
that there was a residence engineer
or that that was something
that I could have done during the meeting. They're
Big in the automotive industry.
They're the people that detect all the little weird stuff
going on inside new car models and blah, blah blah
and come up with a plan to reduce or eliminate those noises.
They also do it in industrial settings.
There's people out there
that can maybe potentially help him.
I would just feel better. I would feel better as that,
as a starting point as opposed to going
through all the expense of
what you guys are talking about doing.
Only for it not to do anything expert
Table and get a residence noise
Expert. But that's just
me. I'm only one of, I'm only one of a bunch
of people up here, but that's just me.
Do do you want table us
and we go get a residence noise expert? I mean I,
I could get behind table.
I'm solve until we get a resident solve.
I'm trying problem. But if I could just review here for,
for the board what's going on yield
before, if we don't hear this and vote
and pass something tonight,
the gentleman's just gonna run seven days
a week, seven to seven.
That's not gonna solve anything.
On the flip side, if we allow them to put this wall in
and the ARBs, they're agreeing
to a one year time limitation,
which I would caution if it doesn't work.
You've obviously heard the board so far.
I understand they're gonna revoke that second shift.
We're understanding it, But really it, it's kind
of a good deal for us in the sense that he's gonna go
through the expense and trouble of putting the wall up
and the ARBs and if it doesn't work,
he loses the second shift.
He's back to where he is.
The neighbors are still better than they were
because there's a nice wall
and shrubs, which is better than nothing.
How is that not a reasonable request,
Mr. Chairman?
Because it's already been pointed out
that he hasn't been following the rules up till now when it
comes to his shift in his work hours.
The problem I have with that, we're gonna hear from Mr.
Pont to confirm in a second in a second is the, the,
how the ordinance is written with the decimal reading if
And sir, I completely discount, I discount any of that
because in my, in my professional opinion,
it is not a decibel issue.
It is a resonance issue.
But let's ag let's, let's assume for the purpose
of this discussion that you're correct,
and you probably are correct.
What by not by being inactive, how does that address the
I don't think we're being inactive, sir.
I think we're just saying we're going to, we're willing
to table until they come back with a resident report
and maybe they have something different
to share with us at that time.
I dunno, I I could understand that viewpoint.
At the same time, if they wanna put up a wall in shrubs
as the first step, I mean, I I think that would be a nice,
I I I mean we,
The one thing Mr. Chair,
the one thing I was thinking about is, um, you know,
I hate to say this, but um, you know, obviously put,
put the wall up, put the, put the trees up,
but suspend the two shifts until we get feedback
for a year on if, whether or not this works.
We, we run one shift for a a year.
I know it's gonna impact his business,
but that's, here we are.
Um, you know,
and to be honest with you, you know, with all the members
of the board, a anywhere between, I know it's a mixed zone,
but anywhere between a business and
and residence, we got walls up.
I mean any, anywhere and everywhere.
So it's not gonna hurt going forward.
The property, you know, going forward in my opinion,
only thing is it's precast,
but it's not poured concrete like planting wants.
But I think to kind of get that, that
site somewhat to get started in compliance,
a wall's a great stuck, the two shifts.
I I, I mean I would like
to maybe see if we did grant the two shifts,
we put some kind of limitation on the hours on Saturday
and definitely no Sunday that's a great, if the board wants
to go that route, we we can do that.
So, um, but I I, to me personally, I I think Mr.
Cliff is spot on, on, on the residence issue, um, you know,
with, with the stamping, um, aspect of it.
So, um, to get more information on that maybe, you know,
a year down the road if this doesn't work.
But I, I don't see a problem granting the wall
and the arbor as is.
But I mean, if we're gonna grant the second shift,
I think we should kind of hone in what he can
and can't do on the weekends
and maybe shave, shave an hour on,
on the weekday or something.
So that, that's my,
that's my thoughts on this whole thing. So I'll yield the floor.
Mr. Chair, Mr. Watts,
I got a, I got a couple questions.
Did you move to this location from another location? Yes,
We did. I've owned,
I've owned the business for 10 years.
I purchased it, it was in Warren.
We've relocated twice and stayed within Warren.
Okay. Okay. So you've always had stamping?
We have always, yes.
We've same line of business throughout
The So obviously you're aware
of the vibrations that it causes?
Uh, yes.
Okay. And
were you aware of the ordinance?
I was not aware of the ordinance
because the previous, uh, the previous owner
of the building was in heavy stamping.
They had owned the, uh, business for the,
it it's always been that,
it's always been a stamping facility.
I I know I, you know, I've lived here all my life.
I've been by that place a gazillion times.
So, um, you know, I looked at it as tool and diet
and look at it as, as a stamping plant.
So, uh, that's, that's news to me
what they did in there. No big
Deal. Both.
Yeah. Um, and, and I agree.
You know, I've driven by it for, since I was a little kid
and you know, when I became old enough
to realize like, who put that there?
Yeah. You know, I, and I get it.
Um, but, you know, I'm hearing the noise, I'm hearing,
you know, all this stuff going on,
operating these other shifts and you know, when his pots
and pans are rattling, I'm looking at it as
that's a vibration coming through the ground
and I'm not sure what a wall
or an arbor is gonna do for that.
Um,
So what, what we're saying is the wall can't hurt
and our understanding up till very recently has been
that when the doors down, that,
that the sound was manageable.
So the idea that we have to open that door
to bring supplies in, take parts out, et cetera,
we thought we put up this wall,
and the wall then acts as the door,
and then we thought about the arbor absorbing nose.
If we install this
and there still continues to be a problem,
then our next step, based on what Mr.
Cliff has indicated, is we'll hire a resident noise
expert and see what we can do with regard to that.
But the, but the, the no lose situation is if we're
unable to solve the problem within the year,
then my client has to go down to one shift.
And then when he goes down to one shift, it'll be seven
to seven according to the ordinance.
But in the meantime, right now he's got 60 employees
counting on him, and he's got contracts with GM
that he needs to, uh, fulfill.
We're in a, we, we need to continue the two shifts
to even justify putting up the wall, making all the plant
plantings and possibly hiring this, um, uh,
resident noise expert if,
if we're ons successful with that case.
If, if, if the two things aren't tied together
for the year period, I think we're just gonna have
to just look at going to the one shift and, and,
and, um, looking at our other options.
Because unfortunately
otherwise we don't know how we're gonna meet our contracts
and, um, also make the improvements.
Listen, I and I get all of that, you know, having a lot
of business and having have extra shifts,
that's a great problem today.
Yeah. I, I get that.
I get, but I also understand these residents, right?
They've been there, they've been there
and they haven't had the problem until this came along
and now they can't go outside
and do the things that they wanna do.
And that's a problem for me.
And we're trying to fix, we're trying to fix it and,
and work with resolving the problem.
Yeah. And the other problem I have is voting
for this variance when we got a potential other variance
coming for the storage and stuff.
I mean, he could piecemeal this to, to death.
And then at the end of the road when he spent,
I don't know how much you're gonna spend.
I don't, I don't, I remember you mentioned numbers on the
wall and stuff, but let's just say for
whatever he spends three, $400,000 and it doesn't work out.
It could get, become a public nuisance.
And then he's out all that money.
So I'm, I'm trying to look out for you too.
You know, I want things right for the neighbors.
I want things right for you.
And I want the taxes from both places coming to our city.
I want everybody happy. So, you know, at this point in time,
I, until we come to some solutions on some of this stuff,
I'm not so sure I can, I can be a yes vote at this point.
So, Mr. Chair, you made some,
some good points that I agree with.
So maybe it'd be a good time to get a motion on the floor
with, I mean, I'm just speaking out loud.
We're gonna, are we working on that with the house?
I think we should have a, a motion on the floor here soon.
But I did wanna hear from Mr. Ponte. Oh, I'm sorry.
He had a moment to research that ordinance.
You gave me more than five minutes. Thank you.
Um, the ordinance as far as the, um,
noise decibels is 75 for M1 80
for M 2 85 for M three
and 90 for M four, the hours of operation
for production are that seven to seven.
If it's less than 200, if it's more than 200 feet,
it's got a different, for the M1 zone,
it's got a different, uh, hours.
And I gotta scroll to that and I can't find that.
That would be six to 11 is the standard for M1
that's further than 200 feet from residential.
Great. And to point out something else,
Mr. Watts mentioned there are nuisance things.
There is also a, in the regulatory, there is nuisance issues
that could be enforced too, if this didn't work out.
So it could possibly not even bother with the zoning
ordinances and go from there too.
Okay. Thank you. Thank you for the insight,
Mr. Chair.
Mr. Cliff, I hate to do it to you, Steve.
I, I kind of breezed through this.
I saw the, I saw that number.
You probably can't answer it anyway.
Under what condition was the test made?
Was everything running in that plant all at the same time?
Was the door open, which would be, uh,
the way I would conduct a noise check?
I would conduct that noise check in a manner of possibility
where whatever's gonna escape out of
that building has the potential
to escape out of that building.
So was our measurement taken with the door closed?
Was our measurement taken with the door open? Do, do we
You are correct.
I cannot answer that. I was not taking the, um,
don't know if it was happening, what was happening.
I know that we tried to come check it unannounced to them.
So surprise checks to try to get natural situations.
So not anything staged.
Uh, so I'm not sure what the actual conditions are.
Um,
That's fair. That's,
that's a fair answer.
I didn't expect and I didn't see it in the, in the backup.
I, I know if it was requested, we can try to find out
or go do additional tests. Yeah,
So I mean, we could, we could set up
schedule and, and get, when
I learned to do 'em, you did 'em in the
worst possible condition.
I, I know when the trucks are lower. I tried to do
that based on the complaints
and the times of the complaints and stuff like that.
We tried going out a week later and everything else. So
I was just curious. Thank you,
sir. I appreciate it. I yield the floor, sir.
No problem. Mr. Mr. Chair. Mr. S Noritz.
I guess I've got a couple questions I just want to ask
to see if the petitioner would be open for, so, so
if, I know we talked about a year,
but how would we feel about like a review,
like something shorter than a year, once the wall
and the trees are installed?
'cause I feel that, you know, that's a lot of time
for an entire year before we get
back together to talk about it.
I don't know what Steve have a
Three or six months after to review that.
Okay. Still drawing on So enforcement.
Okay. So,
but it's, I was getting some wise sage, um,
information, um,
Along your lines.
Uh, along what, what you were asking.
So yes, what, um, Mr.
Wat was indicating was if we went ahead
and installed the wall and the arbor
and once it's installed, um,
we let the city know if you wanna do a time period from
then, so you would table tonight,
this is a suggestion I'm not telling
you would table tonight, the two shifts so
that you could address it on whatever time period you
wanted in the future.
I would say this, that based on what Mr.
Cleft is saying, we are looking to
get this installed, see how it goes, et cetera.
And then we do wanna react with a resident noise expert.
If this doesn't do the trick, we do wanna explore that.
So I will tell you that that's quite frankly our plan.
If, if this doesn't work enough.
And, and in other words, uh, uh,
two shifts would not happen until your, until the wall is up
To, no, the two shifts would continue until
it's revisited, until the tabling
of the two shifts is revisited.
In other words, whenever in the city, um, someone, uh,
has a matter before the ZBA, um,
enforcement freezes, right.
While that's conducting.
So, so we would continue the two shifts and what
Would the hours For those twos, and we would agree not
to do two on Saturday, what
Would be the hours for those two shifts?
So what, from what time to
what time would those shifts fall under? If I could just,
Uh, same as current five 30 to 1130
5:30 AM to 11:30 PM Correct.
And we would agree that no second shift on Saturday
or Sunday or Sunday,
Is there any way that shift can end faster than 1130?
'cause if I was a residence, that seems awfully late.
The ordinance, um, says 11. Can we do 11?
Yeah. So if we aligned it to the normal, no,
if you're within a hundred feet, if
for the normal zoning it's, he said
It's, it's, um, six to 11 to 11,
But you're within 200 feet. So that's why it's seven.
So what we're saying is, we'll, if you want the,
the two shifts during this time period reduced to, um,
what two shifts would be under the ordinance,
we're in agreement with that.
So that would be six to 11 is what the two, two shifts are.
And then we would agree no second shift on Saturdays,
no second shift on Sundays.
And we would continue that until the wall gets in
and the arbor get in and we have a period of time to see the
Work. So Ms. Birdie, what
about if we did something,
could we do something that'd say like five 30 to 10,
Could we do that?
Uh, the, I mean, the only issue you run into is
that you can't give someone a full work day.
So they, they work five 30 to 10 is, uh, with, so, and,
and on top of that, the other thing that I want to note is
that during that period of five 30 to 1130, between breaks
and lunch, there are two hours that we are not operating
that it's completely shut down and, and noise free.
So by the time you take the breaks
and the lunch out of that at five 30 to say, uh, I don't,
I don't know if you suggested 10 30,
it ends up only being like a seven hour
paid days for the employees.
So they can't even be a a, a full-time work week for 'em.
And there's no way to take a, to shave
that two hour window down an hour. And can you
Fold it like on side the middle
Of the, in the middle of the day.
So instead of having the two hours down time,
could you make it an hour downtime so
that the workers get a full week,
Full day? Uh, e each
shift would get a half hour lunch
and two 15 minute break.
So that adds up between the two shifts to two hours of
Uh Oh, okay.
So it's not just two hours dead in the Saturday.
It's, it's, you know, 7:00 PM to seven 30. Okay.
No activity, you know,
and then break later on in the evening.
So I mean, I, I am definitely flexible
to the hours we've been flexible on, on every aspect of this
to try and make a fair compromise.
So
Work on Sundays.
I thought so did you, real quick question.
Did you stipulate you guys don't work on Sundays, right?
We have, since I have owned, uh,
the facility there since we've been there,
we have never worked a second shift on Saturday or Sunday.
This year we have worked two Saturdays from
7:00 AM to 3:30 PM
But no Sundays, Uh,
last year we may have worked a handful of Sundays,
but we have not worked any Sundays this year.
Okay. Just a single Sunday single shift. Sunday
Single shift. We've never
worked two shifts.
Seven to three 30 are the hours.
So typical single shift would be what?
Seven to three what? One single shift? Uh,
Seven to three 30 results in eight hours
of paid time for the
Employee. Alright. Thank you.
Uh, Mr. Mr. Sorry,
I I I'd like to try
and make a motion unless there's other
Discussion or anything.
And as I make this motion, feel free to assist. I'm Okay.
So I'd like to make a motion
to grant the petitioner's request
to construct an eight foot precast concrete wall per
the planning recommendation with the measurements
and setbacks for it
to be installed no later than 10 31 20 25.
Okay. But I'd like to actually add in the stipulation
to have a review 120 days
after the installation of the walls and trees.
Uh, so the petitioner should let the ZBA be aware
of when the completion date is.
I, I do feel a year is too long.
I think 120 days is a much more reasonable timeframe.
And I want to add in
to actually have the petitioner obtain a residence
engineering report on or before the review date.
And so that way they could abide by all recommendations
and basically to approve two shifts,
having it being stipulated for it
to be Monday through Friday.
It was five 30 to 1130 is what he said. Mm-hmm.
1130, correct. Saturday, if you do have to run a Saturday,
seven to three, but no Sundays and no holidays.
Correct. And that is, and that's no Sundays and no holidays.
Yes. The Saturday would be seven to three 30
If, if need be the full,
because you said there were
occasion where you had a need to.
Um, and the reasons being,
uh, size and shape of the lot.
Um, and that's what our fg
So just one question. Just
the Saturday would be seven to three 30? Yes.
So we give a full eight hour. Okay. Thank you. Okay.
But no Sundays and no holidays,
No Sundays, no holidays. Understood.
Ship. And, and also because due to economic
Ship, You might wanna add in that if,
if there are still significant complaints
from the neighbors that
This Can be, that's right.
And the reason being as I wanted
to add in one more item into the, uh, statement reason
for the review 120 days after is
because if there are still unreasonable impacts
to the residents, so these individuals are the key ones
that you need to satisfy if
that this will be reviewed and could be revoked.
Okay. Understood. And
that second shift would be revoked.
That's correct. So have good communication
with these individuals in the audience here
because, uh, I'd like them to come back after that time
and be all happy and say thumbs up.
Understood. Okay. We have a motion on the floor by Mr.
Deitz. We have support for the motion support.
We have a motion by Mr. Deitz.
Support by Mr. Perry to approve.
The modified request is read
Mr. Starch?
Uh, yes. For reason stated in motion.
Mr. Perry? Yes. For reinstated and motion.
Mr. Cliff? No.
The green? Yes.
For the reason stated in the Motion. Mr. Watts?
No. Mr. Assessor?
Yes. For the reasons stated in the motion.
Mr. Lindsay? No, I think this is self-imposed.
I think it's, uh, a detriment to the area.
Mr. Jersey also votes.
No, I also still believe it's a detriment to the area
because it's not in site plan compliant.
There's no compliance on the site. Um, chair Ms. Aya?
Yes. For the reason stated in the motion,
you recite the protocol in the tally.
You got five? Yes. Four. No.
Okay. Your items squeaked by, this is not a variance.
Nope. No. Your item has been approved as modified.
Thank you. Thank you. We'll see you in a couple months. Yes.
This brings us to
Item seven. Item
seven, Item seven.
Applicant Dale Smith, representative Dale Smith.
Description 1 4, 5, 6 6.
Stevens Francis requested permission
to construct a horseshoe shaped driveway, 12 feet and width
and 65 69 feet across in the front yard.
Oh, I'm sorry. Just to clarify.
I, according to the agenda, this is item
I'm, But I'm there,
there is a numbering issue going on here tonight. That's,
You're correct. I read it off
the wrong one. It is
item eight I, I apologize.
But still Mr. Smith. You are,
You're up. Thank you. You have the
floor. Your,
your name and address please.
Hi, my name is Dale Smith.
My address is 1 4 5 6 6
Stevens Road, spelled
S-T-E-P-H-E-N-S Road.
That's Warren, Michigan. 4 8 0 8 9.
Thank you. Please tell us about your request.
Okay, so, you know, as, uh,
I think the city already knows I'm handicapped
and um, I've been up there a couple of times about things,
privacy, fences and such.
I, uh, took advantage
of the dollar purchase on an empty lot when, um,
the other mayor, we won't say his name was in office
'cause some people don't like him and some people do.
I'm not gonna articulate my words for you.
I'm just gonna put it out there the way it is.
I'm handicapped. I got crushed by my vehicle in my driveway,
uh, last year and went to hospital
and you can't see my shoulder over here.
My shoulders popped up, it won't go back down.
I didn't get it. I'm not a football
player, so they wouldn't fix me.
They just left me this way.
So now I can't take my arm and swing my neck around
and look over my shoulder
to back up out my driveway while people are
flying down this, uh, this Stevens road.
They're doing 90 miles an hour at some times.
And you could ask any resident in
that neighborhood if they're not burning tires over there.
They're revving their engines and riding mini bikes
and motorbikes over through there.
And, and I almost got hit and I,
and I followed the guy and I said, did you see me?
You almost killed me. And what did the guy say to me?
I didn't see you. Come on man.
I'm too old for this. I got all this property.
Alls I'm asking for is a horseshoe driveway.
Is that too much to ask?
I don't think there should be a problem.
I got, you know, two
entryways when I brought the other property.
I got the entry over there
and I got a entry over here to my property
and I got one driveway that's real narrow.
And it is just, it's, it's very confining.
It's just, it's not working, you know,
and I've actually been thinking about moving
'cause uh, it's an option.
It really is. I mean, I've been a resident.
I pay my taxes never behind on my bills.
Everyone's getting their money. I hope
everybody's satisfied.
You know, everyone's getting their money right. Okay.
That's all I'm saying. And that's about it.
That's all I'm gonna, I'm not gonna add anything to it.
And Sherry code it. That's just the way it is.
And there's other residents around my house
that got horseshoe driveways
and they're not even handicapped.
So that's that.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Matt, seeing anyone? I close the public course
of the meeting and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair. Mr. Watts.
Mr. Smith? I drove by the other day
and I noticed there's a for sale sign in the front yard.
Yes. That's my option. That's my option.
I'm, I'm thinking about that right now.
Whether I'm not gonna move
or not, if I get the right offer, I might move.
If I don't, I might not move.
Okay. Um, my other question is to Mr. Wat.
I see there's some, uh, some violations were issued here.
Um, do you know if these have been taken care of?
Um, I do not know if they've been taken care of.
Uh, I don't know when he was out there.
If a reinspection has happened yet or not.
I don't believe they all have been.
Okay. I I was on vacation for two weeks,
otherwise I might have tried
to follow up on stuff coming up before
And, and it doesn't say that it was completed.
So I'm okay with that.
Sir, how can you a, can you answer you're doing on these
Violations? I'd love
to respond to that.
Uh, they came out to actually the guy come out
to inspect whether
or not I had the proper amount of space
to do this horseshoe driveway instead.
It's not even code season for him
to start looking around for things.
He jumps out with a satellite photo talking about,
do you mind if I look in your backyard?
I'm like, I'll give you the courtesy of that.
But is it gonna have bearing on my request? No sir.
No it's not. But you just brought it up
so it does have a bearing on my request.
And furthermore, he was outta line
to even come back in my yard and start poking things
and poking his nose around.
'cause it's not even code season.
And I got a privacy fence up for a reason
because I want privacy.
And if I had a little mess back there, I'll clean it up
before code season gets here
and I have been cleaning up, my truck broke down.
I couldn't take care of it.
Yes, I'm upset because wouldn't you be,
you got someone poking their nose
around without having to be there.
It is not even code season time.
So let me address that.
You know what code season time is? Yeah.
In the paper. It's all you guys said.
No, it's all your, sir, anytime they get a
complaint, it's all year long.
It says when they come
during the beginning when April comes, this
Stuff could be enforced anytime of the year.
April, may they start Mr. Smith.
I'm not gonna debate it with you. I drove by there.
You are debating it. I drove by there
and you know, I seen the trailer sitting there.
It don't matter. Lemme stop you
because right now I don't even care anymore What you
got to say Mr. Smith?
So far you're doing okay.
Let's not get into an argument here.
Well, why's he gotta keep bringing that up
Mr. Watts, you have the floor.
I, I drove by there and I seen problems from the street.
I didn't even have to, I didn't have to go in your backyard.
I didn't have to ask you to go in the backyard.
The privacy fence looked dilapidated.
I seen the trailer from the front.
I seen a for sale sign
and I'm questioning what's going on here.
And then I, you know, and I, I had already looked at my
packet and I seen the violation history here.
And quite frankly, I have a problem
with blight issues in the city.
And when I see this, when you're coming to us
and you're asking us to get a variance to do a driveway
and maybe the driveway would be a great idea.
I, you know, I see 'em around, you know, you heard tonight,
we denied guy want to use this whole parking lot,
make a parking lot in front yard.
No, we're not gonna stand for that.
But you know, maybe in your case it might work.
You do have a double lot,
but other issues have to have to be taken care of
before you move forward with something else.
Otherwise we're just gonna wind up with more problems. Well,
No, get my mind back.
I wouldn't even have, I knew, I knew for fact,
you bring up
don't,
it's not so bad when my dog can get outta yard.
You that
don't get along.
It wasn't you
Thursday anyway, But I went right up into the office
and I said, Hey, you know, I'm really tired
of someone poking sticks at me.
I privacy fence my whole yard.
And they're still driving by my house pointing things out.
And I I, it's getting annoying.
Why is it every month, every two weeks,
Mr. Smith, I'm getting another right Mr. Chair,
I'm all set. Thank
you. So that's why thank you
Mr. I'm saying Mr. Smith,
There, there hasn't been a question asked to you.
Now we're discussing this item.
You're on a double lot from the
bird's eye view of your property.
Is there already a, a curb cut on that second property?
Yes sir. Okay, so and that's what you're tying into?
Yes, and I've been moving and cleaning my yard.
I've got a rid of a lot of stuff already,
but I haven't completed it and I'm not, Hey, you know what?
I'm not really worried whether you grant it or not
because I might just move anyway.
That's where I'm going with this.
You know, I'm not gonna beg and plead for it.
If you give it to me, you give it
to me. If you don't, you don't.
Mr. Chair real quick, um, to, um,
to the petitioner real quick.
Um, so both those properties are com are combined?
Uh, one parcel now?
Yes, sir. Okay. Um, Steve Real,
I have a quick question.
Um, so,
so if the, my concern is if, if the lot got, if if,
if he say, say we grant the
variance for the horseshoe driveway.
He, he sells the house anyway.
Um, would a developer be able to come in
and put two houses on that property?
So it's just all still one, one parcel?
I don't know the size of the lots.
Um, so I can't really answer that specifically,
but they are combined right now.
So they would have to be separated
to go through the planning process. If
So, it would've to go through a whole process.
They would've to go through a process?
Yes. Okay, gotcha. Okay, Thank you sir.
Uh, them being residential, it doesn't need a site plan,
but it'd be need building codes and everything else Correct.
And need the lot split from planning.
Understand. Okay. Thank you sir.
So, um, you know,
it does look like he's got two approaches already,
already there to sustain a, a horseshoe driveway.
Um, but that, that was my concern.
If the property got sold, um, you know,
you'd have a horseshoe driveway now
and half of a different lot.
So mind if I speak on that again?
It was just a statement. I wasn't a question, sir.
Oh. When, when I combined the property,
they told me no building are going to be erected over there.
No medic? No. Uh,
I didn't have a question. He
answered my question, so, okay. We're okay.
Thank you sir. You're all set on that. Okay. Alright.
Is there any other discussion from the, from the board?
I personally don't have a problem with the,
the horseshoe driveway.
I know the petitioner mentioned it, it's, it would help
with his disability, but on the same
token he is saying I'm gonna sell my house.
So, um, it's not the best argument to make in the world, but
I apologize for getting allowed too. So
It's already, uh, combined
and the approach is there so it makes sense.
I wasn't trying to get loud.
Any other comments from the board?
Mr. Chairman? Mr. Cliff,
They looking at BSNA.
It, it shows that those are combined into one parcel.
Um, the parcel lending in 0 0 2,
which I think is the north parcel is listed on BSNA online
with the county taxes as being in enacted.
Mr. Chair, Mr. Watts,
Mr. Cliff, did
you It has back
taxes, that's what you're saying?
No, no, that was one line. Oh, okay. Alright.
But what I'm saying is that, oh, it's inactive.
I just wanted to confirm that was the lot is inactive.
That it was one parcel now. Alright, thank you.
It looks like the northern parcel is listed as inactive,
which usually is an indicator that both
of those parcels are not
Combined. Alright, thank you.
Yes, sir. Mr. Chair.
Mr. Lindsay, if there's no other
comments, I'd like to make a motion.
Uh, I'd like to make a motion, uh, to grant permission
to construct a horseshoe shaped driveway, 12 feet in width
and 69 feet across in the front yard.
Reason being, it's not a detriment to the area
and size of shape of the lot
Support. We have
a motion by Mr. Lindsay. Support by Mr.
Neitz to approve the request was read.
Mr. Lindsay, Uh, yes.
For the reason stated in the motion. Mr.
Stevi? Yes. For reason stated in motion
Mr. Perry?
Yes. For the reason stated in motion. Mr. Assessor?
Yes. For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Green, No property is not
unique and it's not necessary.
Mr. Cliff? I vote no.
Mr. Watts? No.
There's too many property maintenance issues. Mr.
Jersey votes? Yes. For the reason stated
of motion for Mr. Sfa?
Yes. For the reason stated of the
motion, you have a tally.
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 to three.
Yes, your item has been approved. Thank you. Six.
Thank you.
This brings us to
Item nine.
Item nine. If you've got a comment to make
to me, come on up and make it
You wink at me.
Did I wink at you? If you got a comment to make,
I'll be in a parking lot.
Easy. Thank you. Have a good night.
Hi, good evening. Item nine. Item nine.
Um, applicant Warren Lions Club representative l Lindsay.
Description, 3 0 0 1 13 mile
variances requested permission
to conduct the Warren Lyons Club City fair as follows,
Wednesday, June 11, 3:00 PM to 11:00 PM Thursday, June 12th,
3:00 PM to 11:00 PM Friday, June 13th, 3:00 PM to 11:00 PM
Saturday, June 14th, 12:00 PM to 11:00 PM And Sunday,
June 15th, 12:00 PM to 10:00 PM
Good evening. Good
evening. Um, my name's Al Lindsey
and my address is 36 42 Wakefield Drive.
Troy, Michigan. I'm the chairman
of the Warren Lyons City Fair.
And, uh, I'm here on behalf of the Warren Lions Club.
Uh, we're asking to for permission to have our, uh,
fair again this year.
And we also wanna make note that even though the hours
that you just mentioned, they're 11 o'clock
and 10 o'clock on Sunday, uh,
we make sure all the music from the carnival
and from all of the, um,
entertainment is shut off at 10 o'clock every night.
Um, so it's the same setup that we've had, um,
for the last 65 years.
And our hardship is that we need, uh, ZBA approval
to have the, the fair.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I close the public portion of the meeting
and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair, real quick, I just have a,
a quick comment to the petitioner.
Um, I know you said, uh, the music to shut off at 10,
but Sunday we have rental 10.
So if we made a motion, it's actually at nine.
Could we just say an hour before closing? Yep. Each day.
Okay. Thank you, sir. That's all I have.
I have no problem with this. This is routine.
They always do a wonderful job.
Mr. Chair, if nobody has any
discussion, I'd like to make a motion,
Please do So.
I'd like to make a, make a motion to
approve the petitioner's request to conduct a Warren
Lions Club City fair as follows.
Wednesday, June 11th, three to 11:00 PM Thursday, June 12th,
3:00 PM to 11:00 PM Uh, Friday, June 13th,
3:00 PM to 11:00 PM Saturday June 14th, 12:00 PM
to 11:00 PM And Sunday, June 15th, 12:00 PM
to 10:00 PM With the music being shut off one hour
before closing of the fair each day, reasons being, uh,
detriment, uh, requiring approval of the board
Support We have a motion by Mr.
Sitz, support by Secretary Jersey
to approve the request as read
Mr. Kovich? Yes.
For reasons stated in a motion.
Mr. Jersey votes Yes. For reason
stated in a motion Mr. Perry
Yes. For reason stated a
motion Mr.
Cliff Yes. For the reasons stated in the motion.
Mr. Assessor? Yes. For the reason stated in
The motion Mr. Lindsay? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion
Mr. Green? Yes. For
the reason stated In the motion.
Mr. Watts? Yes.
For the reason stated in the
Motion. Chairman Safa? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion
your request has been approved.
Thank you very much. Thank you.
Hope you guys have a easier night rest. Thank
You. Sorry you have to sit through
all that. Good luck.
This brings us to item 10.
Go ahead. Item 10.
Um, applicant, uh, applicant Plin.
Representative Brian de de Cat and William Linz.
Description 2 5 4 1 1. Ryan,
Mr. Pon, did you,
hold on. Hold
On. Alright. Variances
requested permission
to install a 15 foot high by 45 foot wide,
675 square foot wall sign on the east el elevation
of the building in addition to the wall sign
that is approximately 32 square feet.
Um, we, we noticed that the size of
that sign was greater than 32 square feet.
We reached out to the sign company.
The person that was supposed
to be here from the sign company was on vacation.
I don't know if it was communicated properly to them, uh,
that it had to be reposted.
So I asked this to be, uh, rescheduled to
whenever the posting can happen. So
May 14th be o Okay.
Are we picking a date or just postponing?
Just gonna postpone. We're I'd, I'd like to make a motion
to postpone item 10 to the May 14th meeting.
Second, that motion. We have a motion, uh, to postpone.
Item 10 to May 14th.
14th. Supported by that was Mr. Mr. Assessor. Mr.
Assessor? All in favor? Aye.
Aye. Item 10 has been postponed.
This brings us to item 11.
Item 11, applicant.
Andrew Sev, MGA architects, um,
representative Andrew Sev.
Hopefully I got that right.
I apologize if I got your last name wrong.
You did pretty good. Camera description.
2 6 1 6 0 gross back variances.
Requested permission to allow an area of 75 feet by 85 feet,
6,375 square feet
and C3 district for the open storage of trucks, trailers
for overnight parking, where the primary structure on the
site will be 4,008 square feet.
That's a use petitioner to relinquish variances granted.
8, 9 8 20 21 If this variance is granted.
Good evening. If you could start
with your name and address please.
Good evening. Andrew Mosie.
Uh, MGA Architects 4 3 5 1 Delaware Court, Royal Oak,
Michigan 4 8 0 7 3.
Thank you. Please tell us about your request.
Um, as, uh, secretary stated, we're, uh, looking for, we,
we've received, uh, site plan approval for this project
and we need, uh, a variance to store overnight truck,
uh, overnight truck storage, um, for, uh, delivery trucks.
Um, these are not, um, refrigerated trucks.
They will not be running all night.
Um, this is just for the, uh, use, uh,
uh, of, you know, of the owner
for making deliveries in the, uh, daytime and at night.
It'll, uh, park the trucks
and the owner, uh, Paul Z is also here.
If you have any other questions. Thank you.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I closed the public portion
of the meeting and turn it over to the board for discussion.
I don't believe there was a planning.
There was, oh, there is a planning impact statement
that will summarize into the record.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, for Mr.
Wir at the planning commission, he says,
after review of the request, no issues were found
to impact the abutting local or general public.
Thank you. At this time, I'll turn it over
to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair, Mr. Assessor. Oh, I'm sorry.
Just one quick all night.
So what was this property previously?
This, it stated is it, was it storage
for towed cars or something?
Does anybody know? Here's my question.
I guess my question is,
does this require baseline environmental?
Say again? Does This require a
baseline environmental study?
The, the, the property itself? I'm just curious.
Um, Wrong question. I,
I don't know about, I mean,
mortgage company may require it.
I don't, I don't know who else would be requiring it.
Yeah, I didn't know what the
procedure is. I just wondered.
I think the bank usually will require to, okay. Yeah,
If You're financing, thank you.
But I don't think it's a city
requirement to my knowledge. Indeed.
Yeah. One, one was done.
You, Mr.
Chair.
Mr. Watts, Uh, question to the petitioner,
are you gonna be paving this lot?
Yes. So the whole storage area would be concrete,
um, concrete or asphalt?
Yes. Okay. Thank you.
I'm not a huge fan of the outdoor storage,
but given its location, I think it's okay.
And I also prefer the, the outdoor storage
to be on a hard surface like Mr. Watts pointed out rather
than, you know, gravel or with dust and water problems.
Um, are there other comments from the board tonight?
Just real quick question to the petitioner.
Um, since it's a use variance, uh, how many truck
truck trailers will be stored approximately on the site?
Approximately? Um, like six. Say that again.
Approximately. Like six. Oh, just six?
Yes. And
Just, I mean, and most times they, you know, they, they,
they will be on the road.
So it's not like we'll have the six at the same time. So.
And since you spoke, sir, if you could state your name
and address for the record.
Um, my name is Paul, 2 6 1 6 0
Rose High, uh, Roseberg Highway, Warren, Michigan 4 8 0 8 9.
Thank you.
Um, what, what, what's the, um,
just a quick, quick synopsis.
What's the, what's your business?
What do you, what do you do? Trucking.
Trucking business or, um, what,
what kind of business do you run? It?
It's, um, it's, um, s I'm just curious.
It's, it's, um, it's trucking and warehousing.
Like we have a semi, we have semi trucks
and some box trucks.
We, most times we go out of states
and, you know, the box trucks for the local.
What's your hours of operation
nor normal hours of operation.
You're not a 24 hour operation? No.
Okay. We're not 24 hours of operation.
Most times the trucks are, you know,
we just do dispatching from the office
and the trucks are on the road, so.
Okay. Just trying to get an idea of, you know, a visual,
what you got going on over there.
So I appreciate that. Thank you for indulging me.
Um, me personally, I don't see any issue with this.
Um, everything seems to be lined up.
I mean, the site plan approval, um, and all that.
So, um, I'll yield the floor.
Mr. Wa I have another question.
Uh, to the petitioner, he said warehousing.
Are you planning on building a warehouse on the property at
some point or is it just gonna be truck parking?
The, uh, the part of the building is the, the,
the building has a storage inside.
Uh, okay. Alright. Thank you. Mm-hmm.
Um, nobody else has anything to add.
I'd like to make a motion. Um, I'd like to make a motion
to grant the petitioner, um, to allow an area
of 75 feet by 85 feet of 6,375 square feet in a C3 district
for open storage of trucks, trucks slash trailers
for overnight parking, where the primary,
primary structure on the site will be 4,008 square feet.
Um, the petitioner is also, um,
will relinquish the variance granted on 9 8 20 21, um, due
to the fact of the size and shape of allot
and it's not a detriment to the area
Forward.
We have a motion by Secretary Jersey support by Mr. Perry
to approve the request as read
Mr. Jersey votes. Yes.
For the reasons
State of the motion Mr. Perry?
Yes. For he stated a motion Mr. Starch
Yes. For reasons stated of the motion,
Mr. Assessor?
Yes. For the reasons stated under the motion. Mr.
Clifft? Yes. For the reasons stated in the
Motion. Mr. Green? Yes.
For the reason stated in The motion. Mr. Watts?
No. Mr. Lindsay? Yes.
For the reason Stating in the motion
Chairman Aya? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion.
Your request has been approved.
Thank you. Thank you.
This brings us to item 12,
new business. I don't believe there's any
One moment.
Did you wanna ask? Yeah. About Lowe's watch.
We have a question for Mr.
You weren't here last week though,
so I had inquired about the Lowe's
property. I'm thinking minutes. Um, yes.
Um, I, I did hear that you did
and I really didn't look into it in full detail
as I got back from vacation this week.
And I've been extremely busy.
But I do know that they do have site plan approval for
permanent outdoor storage in certain areas.
I don't know if they're in compliance with that.
And that's what I'll look at. Alright.
I appreciate it. So, yes,
because Steve, that was the question. 'cause uh,
I I, I was told Brian told me
'cause their sales area there has been getting larger it
seems and it's like, I don't even remember
what is the original approved area. Right?
Yeah. That's the problem. I don't, I don't
think Steve, I don't recall either.
And I know I've been doing it longer. So
Any other new business?
I have a question for Mr. WaPo. Don't run off. Shoot.
So the Bowie Street property with the driveway.
Yes. Do you guys now send them
enforcement to remove the concrete?
Um, we wait until
after the, uh, appeal process is done
and then we will send it out 30 days
to get it into compliance.
All right, thank you.
Any other new business? Yeah,
I had one other question.
Um, last time we, we also talked about the,
the flower shop on 13 and Mound
and we haven't seen obviously anything come across
the, the board for that.
Um, they're open for business now.
Um, I'm assuming without permit
13 and Mound, Did we?
No, not at 13 and Mound Not at 13
And Mound. Oh no.
13 and Mound? No,
The outdoor sales.
Yeah. They may have
permanent outdoor sales there. I'll have to look at that.
You know the thing is plan. Yeah.
I think it went through a site plan
and went through planning.
Okay. And kind of avoided us.
I, I believe that's what I heard.
I believe it may have, But I thought the argument they
always had is that they once had a small amount
of permanent out outdoor search at the corner.
Mm-hmm. Where there's now a strip mall. Right.
So when the strip mall got built,
I didn't think they had at that corner.
Should not be valid anymore. Right.
It doesn't move back just
because you build a strip mall there.
Right. I believe they went back to planning.
So I don't know. That's what I
Think too. I looked that,
I looked that up earlier today
before I left, just in case it came up.
And it says under BSNA that earlier this month, it was sent
to planning for a review.
There is no certificate of compliance. Hmm.
The other question was the temporary sign that is
put on the mound side covering the new landscaping
with the bottom of the mounts bent
so they don't touch the sidewalk
and covering two of the bottom signs of the existing, uh,
brick and mortar sign
At 13 and Mound.
Yep. What business is it?
Well, when we talked about it last week,
somebody had mentioned that they had, uh,
they could have one sign, but I don't know that to be true.
So, 13 and Mound
and I, I, I gotta imagine this, that,
that particular property, take a look at it. You'll
See the, the ground sign.
No, it's the big, it's a giant yellow sign.
Giant yellow sign for It has nothing on it right now.
Which corner of 13. And mount
The For, for the flower sales.
I, I'm assuming that's what it's for.
'cause everybody else has their stuff
in a brick and mortar sign.
I know that Mr.
Canery was in this week,
and I believe he did pull a temporary sign permit.
So I don't know if that's what it was
for. I did not review it.
Well that, take a look at that
because if that sign meets the review,
it's covering two other signs on the other brick and mortar
and they actually had to bend the mounts
to make it fit on the little piece of grass
where somebody just spent a bunch
of money putting landscaping in.
Take a look at it. You'll see
I I'll drive by there.
Thanks.
Any other comments? Or new business?
Not seeing any Motion to Adjourn. Council
Of Commissions Appreciation Dinner Monday,
May 19th at the gazebo.
You are requested to RSVP no later than Tuesday,
may the 13th to Mr.
Cutter, chairman of the Council of Commissions,
commissioners and board members are free.
You're plus 1, 2, 3, whatever, or 30 bucks a piece.
I think I covered everything.
Thank you. And Jennifer was one step ahead of you.
She's got the flyer in the Yeah. Thing.
So that email's on there. Thanks for reminding us. Bill.
I'd like to also express thanks to, uh, Ms. Pierce
for putting together this nice, uh, packet for us to review
and, um, go over with rules, regulations
and things of that nature and ordinances
and a whole bunch of, I did
Put all the ordinances there
and I just realized that they were out
of the big, oh, I'm sorry.
They were out of the, the big book
and which we update with amendments.
Right. Um, there are numerous, numerous pages missing.
So if you'd like, um, you should take those out.
Throw them in the recycling and I will fix
It. Okay.
Well thank you for, uh, a step in the right direction.
At least it's something. I appreciate that. Thank you. My
Pleasure.
Um, I will be out of town on May 14th.
Okay. Hope you go somewhere warm.
I'm Sorry. Hope you go somewhere warm and relaxing.
Uh, unfortunately no. Oh,
I'm sorry to hear that.
Thanks for letting us know.
Motion to adjourn.
Motion I adjourn. All in favor, aye. Aye.
Nine 16 meeting adjourned.