Same to minded.
Good evening. I'd like to call the order a regular meeting
of the zoning Board of appeals on Wednesday,
May 14th at 7:30 PM Please rise
for the Pledge of Allegiance. I pledge. Pledge
Allegiance to the flag in all the United States of America
to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God,
indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
This brings us to the roll call,
Mr. Lindsey. I'm
Here.
Mr. Watts? Here. Mr. Green? Here.
Mr. Perry is absent. Mr. Kovich present.
Mr. Cliff? Absent. Mr. Assessor present.
Mr. Jersey's present. Chairman Sia,
Present
Two people absent.
Can we have a motion to excuse, uh,
Mr. Perry and Mr. Cliff?
Motion to excuse support?
We have a motion by Mr. Assessor, support by Mr. Watts
to excuse Mr. Perry and Mr.
Cliff. All in favor? Aye. Have been excused.
This brings us to the adoption of the agenda tonight.
I just believe there's one change related to item
Mr. Chair. I'd like to make
a motion to change, um,
to, what's that?
Is the applicant for item 16?
2 3 1 7 0 Shaner here,
not, not seeing any.
Okay. So we're gonna move item 16
to the June 11th meeting
and keep the rest of the agenda as, as written
For. For reposting.
For Reposting.
Do we have a support? I have support.
We have a motion by Secretary Jersey. Support by Mr.
Neitz to reschedule. Item 16th until June. I'm sorry. 11th.
June 11th. All in favor? Aye. Aye.
Item 16 has been rescheduled.
This brings us to the approval of the minutes of March 12th.
Those were emailed out, I believe last night.
Motion to approve support.
We have a motion by Mr. Watts, support by Mr.
Assessor to approve the regular
meeting minutes of March 12th.
All in favor? Aye.
Aye. The March 12th meeting minutes have been approved.
This brings us to the approval
of the April 9th regular meeting minutes.
Motion to approve.
They were sent out, uh, just a little while ago,
but do we have a support for that or support?
We have a motion by Mr. Watts.
Support by Mr. Green to approve the April 9th minutes.
All in favor? Aye. Aye. I abstain but,
And I abstain to Secretary of Jersey Abstains,
But they have, uh, been approved nonetheless.
Uh, the April 23rd minutes.
I don't believe those have been sent out
yet. Can we have a motion to
Make a motion to move the approval of the minutes
for the April 23rd, 2025 meeting to the June 11th meeting?
Support? We have a motion by Secretary Jersey.
Support by Mr.
Assessor to reschedule the approval
of the April 23rd meeting.
Minutes. All in favor? Aye.
The, uh, April 23rd meeting, minutes
of approval has been rescheduled.
This brings us to item six and I'm sorry,
before we go to item six tonight,
I wanna announce we do not have a full board tonight.
We're down two members. A normal variance requires five Yes.
Votes to pass a use variance requires six yes.
Votes to pass. So that puts you at a,
at a slight disadvantage tonight.
So if anyone in the audience that has an item here tonight,
I wanna give you the option now to, uh, reschedule
to our next meeting when we have a full board.
Would anyone like to, if you'd like
to reschedule, please approach.
I'm not seeing anyone. We'll move on to item six.
Item six, applicant Home Depot.
Uh, representative Caleb gra Kevin.
Description 2 5 8 7 9.
Hoover Variance has requested permission to one,
allow 1,167 square feet
of permanent outdoor storage in a P District two.
Allow 9,770 square feet
of permanent outdoor storage in a C two district for a total
of 10,937 square feet of permanent outdoor storage.
I don't see them here today.
They, uh, have not submitted everything to planning yet.
I know they were waiting on that.
Uh, and we did tell 'em that before it comes back.
It should go to planning first,
but it was scheduled to this date.
Certain. So I don't know if you wanna schedule it out.
Should we go past to be reposted
or if you want to schedule it out?
Should we go past June 11th? Go to end
Of June? I, I, I hear,
heard they were close.
Um, I talked to planning today
and they said they had talked,
but they hadn't received everything yet.
Um, I probably would say out
At Least the next week, month and a half,
uh, or two months.
So that puts us into JU July.
Probably, uh, either the June 25th or July 9th.
20. June 25th might, might be a good date. Okay.
Uh, I'll make a motion to move. Item six. The,
The Home comment. Oh,
do it after or
No, go ahead. Go ahead, Mr, mr. Degree.
I'm ask Mr. Wa kind a question, Mr. Chair. I'll allow it.
Alright. Thank you.
So, so it,
I, If there's a question as to whether
or not this meets the, the, the site plan that was approved,
will, will the site plan itself be looked over
before planning sends it back here for the variance
Planning? Will look at it?
Um, usually we won't get a copy of
that approved until everything is done.
Uh, so if you want to follow what planning's doing,
my suggestion is probably follow it when it's on the meeting
or ask call planning
and ask them if that's what you're asking.
So it pot potentially could come to this board
and not comply with the site plan?
Well, you, and we want and,
and we're to vote on the
variance. You understand where I'm going?
Well, basically, anything that comes
before this board is not in compliance completely
with the site plan, but there is recommendations
from planning commission.
If for some reason it doesn't go forward
with planning issues
and it is detrimental to the variance requested,
we will ask that it get tabled and go forward from there.
So there it depends on the situation,
I guess would be the answer.
In this case, we're waiting for the site plan
and they knew we were gonna wait for the site plan
before it came, before the zoning board
In this, this case. So are they, are
they operating on the existing site plan
or will they, will there be a new site plan
for this particular item?
I'm just, they are not operating on either at this point
in time from what I've seen that
Answers my question. Thank you.
Enforcement is happening.
Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank
You. Do we have
a motion to, um,
I'd like to make a motion to, um, move item six, um,
2 5 8 7 9 Hoover to the June 25th meeting. Support.
We have a motion by Secretary Jersey. Support by Mr.
Noorwood to reschedule Item six until our June 25th meeting.
All in favor? A aye. Item six has been rescheduled.
This brings us to item seven.
Item seven. Applicant plin representative Brian uct.
William Linz. Um, common description, 2 5 4 1 1.
Ryan Variances requested permission
to install a 15 foot high by 45 foot wide,
675 square foot wall sign on the east elevation
of the building and retain a 24, a 24 24 foot
by 24 foot, 48 square foot existing wall sign for a total
of 723 square feet of wall signage.
Good evening. Good evening. Brian Duque sign, Ramon.
3 6 8 8 6 Harper Clinton Township.
And I am representing Plin.
Unfortunately, uh, Richard had a knee replacement
and was not able to join us this evening, so as long
as the board's comfortable going forward without 'em,
I'll be happy to answer any questions I can.
That's fine. Is there anything else you'd like
to add about your request?
No, I think it's pretty straightforward.
Obviously it's a very large facility
set back a long ways off the road
and they're looking to do something to make it look more
appealing than just a big building saying way back.
Um, and this is the, the art
that would be going up on the sign should it be permitted.
Thank you. You're welcome. Welcome.
Is this a public hearing? Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I close the public portion of the meeting
and turn it over to the board for discussion. Mr.
Chair. Mr. Mr. Sorowitz?
No. Um, are we all in favor of like,
signage for buildings and such,
but, um,
It's weak. Oh, it's
weak. Okay, fine. There you go.
There, there you go.
But the size of the sign is the thing that concerns me
because it doesn't look, it's not just like a sign
that says, you know, this is the business that's here.
It's like a billboard. And I personally think
that's overkill for a building.
If you're just looking for signage to help with shipping
and receiving and all that sort of stuff.
That's my 2 cents worth.
I do have a question for the petitioner.
Is this large, um, kind of decorative wall sign is,
is it like a, a banner
or is it something more permanent? That's gonna be,
It's gonna be a flex face sign.
So like your larger signs, Myers, all
that they use flex face.
This would be a heavy material that's durable.
It's gonna last. Banners are typically 13 ounce,
not really made for long term.
Okay. So this is not gonna be something they're gonna
put up and it's gonna look worn and tattered.
Okay. Is It in one down
Road? Is it illuminated?
It is not illuminated. Okay. It is a full frame.
It is tensioned, like a flex face,
but it is non illuminated.
Okay. Thank you. Any other comments from the board,
Mr. Chair?
Mr. Green? Yes.
So not a big fan of signs, but that's not what I'm here for.
But I think it's way too big.
I think it's a branding sign, like an item we had
before us a few weeks ago.
Directional signs sometimes are effective,
but a lot of stuff I studies I see, say, uh, signage,
especially the branding signs don't necessarily
increase business' visibility.
So I I'm really not, I I'm gonna vote no
because I just think these signs are too big
and it looks like you're going to a circus.
So, which that's my comment. Ryan,
Uh, Mr. Chair.
Um, I kind of, uh, echo the same sentiment
as my, my colleagues too.
Um, I have a problem granting 723 square feet
of wall signage for that property.
Um, I, I fully believe that it's, it's an, it's,
it's not an, it's not an economic issue.
It, but it is a detriment to the area
and it's self imposing.
'cause they want to, you know, basically put it up.
So there's no real rhyme or reason.
You know, the business has been
established there for many, many years.
Um, so I don't have a problem with keeping the existing sign
that's on the premises, the 24 foot by 24 foot, um,
at 48 square feet.
But I think the other sign is just
way too big for the property.
Mr. Chair, Mr. Lindsay?
I think I feel the same way, uh, as Mr. Jersey here.
I'm definitely fine with the,
the 24 foot sign out in the front of the building.
I think that's tastefully done.
Um, I agree with everybody here on the board.
Um, the other sign 45 feet, that, that's huge.
Uh, that is a very large sign
and it, it does seem to me more like just kind
of free advertising, uh, for the company.
I would much rather see, um, you know,
you advertising the name of your company, um,
in a more tasteful way.
Um, so I I would be in favor of approving, um,
the 24 foot sign,
but I I'm not gonna vote yes on,
on the 45 foot sign tonight.
Based on the, the board that the tone of it,
it doesn't sound like this is something
you'd be able to prove tonight.
Maybe we should table this
and wait until Richard's able to attend this meeting.
'cause I don't wanna speak on their behalf.
Okay. Is there, um, Mr.
Chair, does the board, I'd also like to ask the board
to consider, is there a certain compromise
that we would make on that additional sign?
If, if we would allow some sign
and he could, we could table this item
if we thought we wanted to allow something on that wall.
Um, Mr. Watts, did you have something you wanted to add? So,
Um, sir, is there any way to downsize that?
I mean, I know you can't speak on their behalf.
I can't, but I can, I can obviously present it when we
come back, have options available if
that's a direction we think we should be be going.
Obviously I did some math in the facility.
It's a 21,000 square foot facility. It's a big building.
Yeah. And something too small is not gonna show up.
It's gonna be like a stamp on a, you know, eight
and a half by 11 envelope.
This is not a little building.
And this is not 50 foot setback.
This is hundreds of feet setback.
So, although may it look big on paper when you're looking at
it from the road, it's not very big.
So it's, it's kind of represented the size of the building.
Right. I, I did quick math
and it was almost 21,000 square foot facility
and there's quite a large parking lot in front of it,
so the viewing distance is substantial.
But that being said, you know,
I I I would like pa be represent themselves if this is not
something you could easily agree to.
All right, thank you. I I would make a motion to table.
Do we have support for that? Support?
We have a motion by Mr. Watts. Support by Mr.
Neitz to reschedule or table item seven.
Uh, is June, what? When is our next meeting? June.
June 11th. June 11th. Is that enough time? Should be,
Should be fine. We
say always healing. So any recommendations?
I should go back to 'em with,
You know, we do have a may.
I skipped. We have a May 28th meeting.
Would you prefer to have that meeting that sooner?
I think I'm out of town that week.
Okay. So we'll keep it June 11th. June 11th?
Yeah, I think June 11th. 11th should be fine.
Okay. Okay. Did the board have any recommendations?
Come back with, or you want me just
to bring some options back?
I think it'd be a good idea to come back
with a couple different options. Perfect.
You gentlemen and ladies have a board for evening.
Thank you. We need to vote on,
We'll get a vote on It. Hold on.
We had a motion that was by Mr. Watts. Yeah.
Support by Mr. Neitz to, uh,
table item seven until June 11th.
All in favor? Aye. Aye. Item has been tabled.
I vote no. Just to, for the record.
Takes this to item eight. Applicant Joseph and Suzanne gat.
Representative Joseph
and Suzanne GAT county description,
3 0 1 1 0 Blossom lane variances.
Requested permission to retain a 12 foot by 10 foot shed
outside the side building lines of residence
to within three feet of the south property line.
Good evening. Good Evening.
If you could both please state your name and address.
Suzanne gat. 3 0 1 1 0 Blossom Lane.
Thank you. Joseph Gat, 3 0 1. One zero Blossom Lane.
Thank you. Please tell us about your request.
Um, we have, uh, we've lived in this location
for over almost 30 years now.
Um, we have a shed put in 27 years ago, which we thought,
um, permits
and everything were pulled for,
which we found out that they weren't.
And now, um, the shed is three feet, um,
from the property line.
It sits outside the house about two feet, somewhere abouts.
So you can, you can see through it between the,
the two houses you can see through.
Um, we did not,
we thought everything was under in compliance.
We had no idea. And,
And we got a letter in January.
We got a letter in January, um, saying that we were,
We were violating the OR ordinance.
We did take a picture to show if, if it helps us to show
how much it's, it, it stands out.
It stands out. Um, we had it, uh,
the inspectors came out and checked and there is a rat wall.
And from my understanding, it looks like it's all, uh,
to code it, it's to code, it would pass code.
It's just a matter. It's, that's, it's not in the ordinance.
It's outside the, the, uh, the building.
Thank you. Thank you for your comments.
This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Yes. Could you please approach
if the petitioner could just step to the side?
Hello, Your name and address, please? Cindy
Foltz. 3 0 1 4 5
Blossom Lane.
Thank you. Um, I've been neighbors
with Joe and Sue for 30 years.
I don't understand why this is an issue.
There's so many other things on our n in our neighborhood
that should be addressed.
And they shovel their snow, they cut their grass, they keep,
you know, take good care of their property.
So I don't understand why they're going having to go
through all this for a shed
that you can see down the property line.
So That's all
I thank you for your comments.
Okay. Is there anyone else in the audience please approach.
Hello? Hello, I'm Lisa Langford.
Address 3 0 0 6 6 Blossom Lane.
I am directly to the south of them.
There has not been a problem with that.
Shed, I don't know, 30 years at least.
So I don't understand what the issue is now.
It doesn't hinder anything.
It's weeds don't grow between the shed
and our fence.
So it's well maintained
and I just dunno what the issue is at this point.
Thank you for your comment. Is there anyone else in
the audience who would like to speak?
Not seeing anyone. I close the public portion of the meeting
and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair. Mr. Lindsay?
I just wanna say to the audience
and anybody watching in the public,
I personally really enjoy
and appreciate hearing from the community
and the neighbors When we hear these items, it is
so important for me to make a decision on how,
how it's affecting people in the community.
Um, this particular request, uh, I see no issues with it.
Um, the ordinance is saying it just
can't be in a line of sight.
Um, so that's why that two feet's an issue.
Um, but it's tastefully done. Your guy's yard is well kept.
It's a beautiful shed. You said it had a rat wall, correct?
Yes, sir. That, that's my number one
concern. If it's, it was inspected
By Paul, um, Jose, I think his name is the inspector.
He came out and I had a hold dug and he checked that
and it was all, it was all
Fine. Yeah, the, the
rat wall is the, the number one concern.
But this, this is a beautiful property.
You guys are, are maintaining it.
I have no issues with this,
so I would support your request. Thank
You. Thank you,
Mr. Chair. Um,
so, you know, typically in the past, you know,
we, we've always held a, a a pretty solid standard to,
you know, site, you know, sheds in the line of sight.
Um, but I think this is a exterminating circumstance where,
um, you know, said petitioner didn't realize
what was going on on the property
until they decided to do something to their property.
And we see this time and time again on the board
where you try to upgrade your property,
you find out other things in the past weren't permitted
when they said they were.
And now it red flags everything.
So this isn't to me, um, a detriment
to, to the neighborhood.
I don't think it's self imposing at all
because, you know, most of it was, was there to begin with.
So, um, it's a beautiful yard to be ashamed
to have them rip up.
I mean the, the nice backyard that they have.
That's just my opinion.
So I think, you know, for me personally, I think this,
this is one where we could have a little bit of wiggle room,
you know, the shed, you're, you're talking
a matter of what, three feet?
I mean, less in the line,
less of sight, less than three feet.
It's not like the whole shed.
I mean, there's plenty of sheds in this town
that are in the line of sight that probably
need to be red flagged too.
But that's neither here nor there.
But I, I, I'm, I'm in favor of trying
of granting these people the, the variance.
Um, I don't see anything wrong with this
Mr. Chair, Mr. Watts.
Um, you know, if this was somebody that popped the shed up
last month or in the last few months, you know,
I'd probably be a no vote for not following the code.
But after 27 years and nobody's complained,
and obviously your neighbors love you.
Um, and I live a few blocks over.
I drove by and took a look at it.
Your property's very nice
and I agree with you about other things that need
to be taken care of in the neighborhood.
Thank you. Um, but yeah, after 27 years
and no complaints, it's, you know, I, I don't see
where it's a problem, so I'll definitely
vote. Yes. Thank you.
Thank You. Thank you,
Mr. Chair. If nobody else has
anything else to add, I'd like
to make a motion, um, make a motion to grant the petitioner,
um, permission to retain a 12 foot by 10 foot shed
outside the side building lines of residence
to within three feet of the south property line.
Due to the fact it's not a detriment to the area
Support.
Can we hold on for one moment? But Mr.
Mont, I'm just gonna talk about,
Oh, okay. Oh, great.
I'm sorry that that was a motion
by Secretary Jersey.
Support by Mr. Lindsay to approve the request
as presented. Mr.
Jersey votes? Yes. For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Lindsay? Yes. For
The reason stated in The motion. Mr. Watts?
Yes. For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Green? Yes. For the reason Stated in the motion. Mr.
Assessor? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion,
Uh, Mr. Stevi
say yes. For
The reason. The motion.
Motion. Gotta get you a new microphone over
here. Chairman sfa? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion,
this request has been approved.
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you a good night. You too.
Texas. Item nine, applicant.
Patricia Brown, representative Patricia Brown.
Common description, 2 4 5 2 1.
Columbus, we requested permission to construct a 12 foot
by 10 foot should they extend nine feet beyond the north
building lane of the principal building to within six feet,
11 inches of the north property lane.
Good evening. Hi. Thank you.
If you could start with your name and address, please.
My name is Patricia Brown.
I live at 2 4 5 2 1 Columbus Avenue in Warren.
And unfortunately a year ago, um, I had
to demolish my one car garage.
It was an attached garage.
Um, due to it being a hazard
and doing the right thing, I knew that it needed
to be demolished, which I did do.
And, but that left me with a dilemma in that
my home has no basement
and I have no garage,
therefore, I have nowhere to be able to store
my garden equipment.
My, my power tools.
I like to build things, um, yard stuff,
trash cans, those things that tend
to be sightly and get in the way.
And, um, the,
my idea is to
put up a 10 by 12, um, shed
where the back part
of the now non-existent garage was.
And there is a rat wall already existing
exactly in the spot that I can fit that 10 by 12 foot shed.
Um, I do have
a shed that's been existing on my property
for the entire time that I have lived there.
And when the garage came down
and we were just, you were mentioning that
now, because it can be seen
and it's rather unsightly that is going to be demolished,
um, and taken down.
But again, I am, I,
my dilemma is I have no way to store anything,
um, on my property.
So that's why I am requesting the variance.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I close the public portion of the meeting
and turn it over to the board for discussion. Mr.
Chair. Mr. Green.
So Mr. Brown, the garage that you tore down, was
that a slab tore up at the same time?
No, it, the, the, it's very long driveway
and the entire area where the garage was,
the existing slab and rat wall are still there.
So is your intention to flip the shed on that
Yes. Know on
the existing garage
Slab? Yes. What was
the, the, the pavement,
uh, concrete slab that the garage was on.
It had a rat wall around it.
I do not have a, um,
my house isn't even on a slab.
It's on a rat wall.
So, so, so this secondary shed is still up,
you referred to another,
The, the original one that's been there since,
since I moved in 20 years ago. It's
Still there. It's
there, but it's Not on a slab then?
It's on a slab, but
because you can now see it from the street
and it's, it's really, it's old.
It's gonna be, I'm gonna be taking that down.
It's help me out here.
So you, you, you left the drive, the garage slab there,
and how, how large is, it's hard to tell from these horse.
How large is that garage slab
that where you tore the garage down?
Is it, is it 12 by 10? It's right here.
You see where I'm going? Is, is this Yes. Is
This, yes. I see
where you're going. My driveway
Stuck on a garage slab.
Yeah, it was a single car garage.
How I, I, okay. It was 14 feet wide.
Um, and then from the street to the,
to 10 feet behind the house,
it's all a concrete slab.
So the driveway goes right next to the house
and then also 10 feet behind.
And that's, that's where I would like to put the shed, the,
the 10 feet by 12 feet would literally fit in
that area where the back part of the garage used to be
With four feet, with four feet
left over. Somebody help me?
I can, can, can I just interject real quick? Go ahead.
I'm sorry. Um, so I, the, the way I'm looking at this,
first off, there's no real print to go off of.
I'm guessing. Is this what she submitted to, to go off of
as far as a sketch print, or, okay.
If you, if you, I can explain.
So first off, you need, I think that she is trying
to get the 12 foot by 10 foot shed put on the, the slab
to avoid redoing a rat wall by the sound of it.
I, so to ma'am, I haven't, I haven't posed a question
yet, was, I'm sorry.
So, um, so my thought is, I mean,
if the old one comes down, she probably wants to put the 12
by 10, obviously, on the, on the current existing cement
trying to, you know, probably save,
save a couple dollars I would imagine.
So my, the other thing is, there's plenty of property
where this doesn't even need to be.
I'm, I'm not against the shed, you know, I'm not against,
you know, you having a shed.
I'm just, I'm against the placement of it.
So, you know, you just heard with the last petitioner,
you know, we have a strict thing, you know, a little bit
of line of sight is fine, fine,
but this whole thing's still gonna be visible just like the
old one from the street.
So to me, I think, I mean, there's plenty of room
behind your property, correct me wrong,
to put a 12 by 10 foot. Well,
On that, on, unfortunately
my property floods,
But the, I Mean, in that back area,
any area in the back, literally when we had
the winter storms that we had, I had to go to Home Depot
and get huge pumps to pump out my yard,
which I am also working on that this year.
Um, it, I literally have six inches
of standing water three to four times a year in my backyard
that I have to pump out.
There's no way I can construct a concrete slab
behind the existing house with a rat wall.
So when my driveway is already where a garage used to be,
and it has an existing rat wall, it's not a matter
of saving money.
It's a matter of Well, it's con it's more convenient.
Um, I have nowhere, I, again,
no garage, no basement.
I have a lot of tools, yard equipment, stuff
to keep my yard looking nice.
I have nowhere to store it.
I mean, again, I'm not, I'm not
against the shed. It is just,
And I, I I think
A picture of the shed, it's,
I well, you've got a picture of the shed,
but I mean, usually we have some kind of sketch diagram
to go off of that.
I mean, we're kind of going off of blocks off
of a, a Google map thing. So if I Yeah.
Go. I can go interject. I have to,
I'm Sorry. Visualize
this. Yeah.
So when you pull your car into your driveway, which side
is the, is your home on the right side or the left side?
It's on the left side. Okay.
So when you imagine you had your garage still,
you pull up the driveway, you go 10, 15 feet from the road
and your house is on the left side, correct?
Yeah. Okay. And then you keep going another 10 feet
and you had your one car garage attached to your home?
It used to be. Okay.
But the one car garage was sli was slightly
back from the front line of your house?
Oh, it was? Yes.
In fact, it was at the very back of the house.
Okay. So you kept driving Dr.
You, you'd go by your side door or you'd go by the backyard
and then it was all the way in the back.
Correct.
The garage was
the, the garage there is a back door
and then a five foot wall behind
that back door on the side of the house.
It only went from the back door to the back
of the house was only about five feet.
Okay. And the garage was placed
near the proximity of that back door
and extended 10 feet.
Uh, well, actually it was about a 20 foot garage.
So there, there's a 20 foot
And, and you're proposing to put the gar garage, the,
the shed as far back as you can on that slab? Yes,
As far back as I can.
Yes.
The, the problem with that is you're replacing your
garage with a more temporary structure.
It, the, the issue is not the shed, it's just the placement.
I know there's the water problems in your backyard.
It looks like you have a pretty large backyard.
There's a shed back there.
Now, is that not on any type of, of slab?
It's, it's on a slab, but because of the city ordinances
and the, um, and when the inspector came out
after I had the garage demolished
and approved everything, she was the lead variance.
He said by the, that shed is now visible from the street
and it is like 21, 22 years old
and it's getting dilapidated and I wanna remove it.
And where is the, do you have the new shed purchased yet?
No. Okay. No, I'm, I'm not gonna do that.
I mean, I'm not a big, I'm not a fan at all
of having the shed on the, the driveway slab whatsoever.
I'm not really a huge fan
of having it completely visible from the street,
but I, I would rather see your new shed on that old slab
because at least it's clear that it's
in your backyard way back.
It's too small, But it, according to the ordinance,
it would still be visible. So I'm kind of,
Well, that's what I'm gonna discuss here
with the board is Okay.
Is some type of compromise.
I'm definitely not a fan of having it replaced
where the one car attached garage was for me.
And I, I'm not a huge fan of it being visible from the road,
but I think a decent compromise would be let her put the
shed where the old shed is,
where the old shed is on the slab.
Mm-hmm.
Mr. Chair, Mr. That's
It. Microphone works.
Now finally, question for Mr. Wa pound.
My question is, is like
before four when her garage was still existing,
would that old should have qualified
because it would've been behind the sight lines
of the old garage, correct? Right. So
It's, um, I don't know the distance it was, it has
to be within three feet of another accessory structure,
which would've been the garage.
So if it was within three feet of the garage, yes.
I I don't know if there was a permit on it either.
I know it had a rat wall from what I've been told,
but I'm not, I, I wasn't on this and,
and not very familiar with this project.
Okay. Because, but yes, it would've been legal
behind the garage on
The property because what makes the one need an ordinance
is because the garage is no longer there,
therefore now it's visible. Um,
That makes the property unique. Yeah.
Yeah. Mr. Chair. Exactly.
And I could actually, I like the idea that someday
that GR garage could get replaced
and the pad is there for the garage.
Right. I would have, I could have,
I would've no problem supporting the new shut being on the
old slab.
I, I think I could get behind,
Behind. Would that have to be
reposted, Mr. Pont?
Um, Or do we have measurements?
The request is outside the building lines.
That would still be outside the building lines.
So I don't see why it would,
you guys could just be put a condition
that it be set back further than,
Or set back where the old shed is. Yes.
Okay. I think that could be done. I don't know.
I, I, I guess I would want to verify that
with the city attorney.
Could we do that And it,
the new shed the same dimensions or Yeah.
I don't, I don't believe it needs to,
I don't believe it needs to be reposted
because the request would be the same.
Okay.
Mr. Watts, did you have a comment to
Make? I do.
So I'm looking at a Google Street view of your house,
and I'm looking at the driveway.
Yes. I hope I got the right house.
I think I do, but I can see like a white
tent structure in the driveway.
That would've been the old garage.
Then it looks like the garage is behind that.
And there's, I'm sorry, you were looking at what again?
I'm looking at a front view of your, of your driveway.
Yes. And it looks like there's,
there's a car in the driveway
and there's like a white canvas tent type structure.
Oh, wow. Yeah, I had a garage sale
Of, it's, it's probably old.
I had a garage sale. That's,
So that's the garage right behind it. Then that
Was the garage right behind it.
That was a 20 foot that,
Okay. It goes
back quite a ways. My driveway
Very long. Okay. That makes sense to me.
All right.
That makes, that makes good sense to me. Well,
Let Me, let me ask the petitioner,
you've heard our comments so far that we're not a fan
of the shed in the spot.
You propose? Yes. We think a good
compromise is moving it back.
But you have to accept that, you know,
you would be in agreement with that.
Do you, uh,
So you're just saying that once I remove the old shed just
replace she it with a new one.
Put you can put a new shed on the, on
On the existing slab in the backyard.
Does that have a rat wall on it though? Exactly.
Yep. I thought removed.
It'd have to be inspected anyway. So if we, it's
Going a new shed removed.
See, I listen to you in the Okay.
Do we have a, okay, you wanna make a motion?
Would someone like to make a motion?
I'd like to make a motion to grant the, per the petitioner
to construct a 12 foot by 10 foot shed
that extends nine feet beyond the north building line
to the principal building line to within six foot 11 inches
of the north property line.
And have the new shed built on
the current slab where the old shed is.
Um, due to the fact it's a unique lot, the size
and shape of the lot is unique
and it's not a detriment to the area.
Support. Support. We have a motion
by Secretary Jersey, support by Mr.
Nurse Noritz to approve the modified request is read Mr.
Jersey votes? Yes. For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Stevi? Yes. For reason stated in motion Mr.
Assessor? Yes.
For the reason stated in The motion. Mr. Green?
Yes. For the reason stated
In the motion. Mr. Watts?
Yes. For the reason stated motion.
Mr. Lindsay? Yes.
For the reason stated in the Motion Chairman sfa? Yes.
For the reasons stated in the motion,
your modified request has been approved.
Thank you very much. I appreciate
It. Thank you. Have a
good night. This brings us to item 10.
Item 10. Applicant Thomas and Colleen Farra.
Representative Thomas and Colleen Farra.
Common description, 1 3 7 2 8.
Taft variance Requested permission two one construct a 15
foot by 15 foot 225 square foot covered porch in the rear
setback to within 17 feet, three inches
of the rear property line two, retain rear setback
of residence at 30 feet.
Three, three inches.
Good evening. Good evening.
If you could please start with your name and address.
Colleen Farrah. 1 3 7 2 8 Taft Drive.
Thank you. Thomas Farrah, 1 3 7 2 8 Taft Drive.
Thank you. Your request is pretty self-explanatory,
but if you would please tell us about it.
So, um, our home, the backyard faces south
and we would like to, um, build a porch covered porch
so that we can utilize our backyard.
'cause the sun is, um, unbearable quite honestly
during the days in our backyard. Yeah.
Be because our house is facing, the back is facing south,
the sun's going east to west, so it's all day long. Mm-hmm.
Okay. Thank you for those comments.
It says a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who would like to speak on this item?
I'm not seeing anyone in the audience,
but we do have a, a short, uh,
blurb from the neighbor, short
Correspondence from a Joanne Namal from
1 3 7 0 5 Taft as neighbor.
They're fine with it. They're good neighbors
and keep up their property.
That's it. Thank you. At this time I'll turn,
I'll close the public portion of the meeting
and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair, Mr. Green.
So on drawing you maybe clarify for me,
so you have an existing deck back there?
No, the survey that we have is from our original purchase
in 1992.
That answers my question and there was a huge deck. Okay.
We currently have a small patio or smaller patio.
Good enough. Thank you. I have no problems with this.
I think it's gonna be a nice addition.
Absolutely. Mr.
Chair, if nobody else has anything else
to say, I'd like to make a motion.
Um, make a motion to, uh, give permission
to one construct, a 15 foot by 15 foot,
220 square foot covered porch in the rear setback
to within 17 feet, three inches of the rear property line
and two, retain, retain the rear setback
of residence at 30 feet, three inches.
Due to the fact the size and shape of a lot,
it's not a detriment to the area.
So, support. We have a motion by Secretary Jersey.
Support by Mr. Assessor
to approve the request as presented. Mr.
Jersey votes? Yes. For the reason.
State in the motion Mr. Assessor?
Yes. For the reason stated in the
Motion. Mr. Green?
Yes. For
The reason stated in The motion.
Mr. Lindsay? Yes. For
The reason stated in the Motion.
Mr. Watts? Yes.
For The reason stated in the motion. Mr. Starch?
Yes. For the reason stated in the
Motion Chairman sfa? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion.
Your request has been approved. Thank
You. Thank you for
Your time. Thank you.
Enjoy your sunroom.
Bonnie Cover
Takes this to item 11.
Item 11, applicant Patrick Rosen Nik
I Representative Patrick Nik.
Captain description 2 2 3 7 0.
Curry variance has requested permission
to retain a horseshoe driveway
that is one in the front yard.
Two non-hard surface gravel main drive
to remain hard surfaced.
Good evening. Hello.
If you could start with your name and address please. Uh,
My name's Patrick Rasnick.
I live at 2 2 3 7 0 Curry Avenue in Warren.
Uh, trying to retain my, uh,
current horseshoe drive that has been there
for about 50 years.
I, I guess, uh, I have pictures
of it from the McComb County, uh, uh, website
that it's been there for, for all those years.
Uh, all I did was put, uh, crush concrete over it
and made it look presentable.
That's basically what I did.
Thank you for those comments.
This, is this a public hearing?
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Yes. If you could please approach.
Good evening. Good evening.
Your name and address, please?
Uh, name's Henry Burden.
Uh, 2 2 4 6 6 Curry Avenue. Warren. Thank
You. And your comment,
Um, since he moved in the house is immaculate.
He keeps an immaculate yard.
Um, people there before was nothing.
And like previous people have said, we got more issues
with more properties on our block.
I mean, there's one young lady, it's like a junkyard,
you know, and, and that I've been there since 91
and that drive's been there.
So, but since he's moved in, he's,
he's made it more presentable
and he don't let the weeds get in it, you know,
and he, he takes very good care of his property
and it's glad, we're glad to have 'em
because, you know, like guess again, there's some properties
that they need to address, you know, so.
Sure. Thank you for those comments. Yeah.
Is there anyone else in the audience
who would like to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I closed the public portion
of the meeting and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair. Mr. Green, I did
Drive by your property and it is
the nicest house on the street.
I have, I absolutely no problem with this. Uh, a variance.
Any other comments from the board or motions?
Mr. Chair? Mr. Watts,
Nobody else has a comment. I'll make a motion.
Please do, Uh, make a motion to allow the variance
to retain a horseshoe driveway that is in the front yard,
non-hard surface gravel main drive
to the remain hard surfaced
Support. We have
a motion by Mr. Watt, support by Mr.
Assessor to approve the request is read.
Mr. Watts? Yes. As for the re and stated the
Motion Mr. Ser?
Yes. For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Green? Yes. For The reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Lindsay? Yes. For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Stevi Yes. For reason stated in the motion
Mr. Jersey votes Yes.
For the reason
stated in the motion Chairman sfa?
Yes. For the reason stated in the motion,
your request has been approved.
Thank you very much. Thank you. A good night.
This brings us to item 12.
Item 12. Applicant Ron Hur, representative Ron Hur.
Common description. 3 0 3 0 1 GLODE
variance Requested permission.
Two. Allow the expansion of a non-conforming church
by constructing accessory structure
with the following conditions.
One 30 feet by 50 feet. 1500 square feet.
Two 14 feet in height at the eaves accessory structure.
Three. Outside of the side building lines
of the principal building also.
Two. Four. Continue non-conforming use of a church not
on a major thoroughfare.
Five. Continue nonconforming use of a church with wall
or green belt screening.
Where the or sight of buts, residential districts or uses.
Good evening. Hi. Good evening.
If you could please start with your
name and address. Alright.
My Name is Ron. Her address 3 0 3 0 1 Glode.
Thank you. And anyone else who might speak,
if you could state your name and address.
Yep. Isaac Sho. 3 0 3 0 1 Glode.
Thank you. Uh, KU Hay.
3 0 3 0 1 Glode.
Thank you. Please tell us about your request.
Yeah, uh, Mr. Chair and board.
Uh, basically, um, this is our second time here.
This is, uh, essentially our church wanting to add a, um,
storage, uh, shed
or I guess in the, by the size, almost a pole barn kind of,
uh, structure to, um, store our lawn equipments
and, uh, you know, um, just supplies that, uh, we use
for church, uh, maintenance and things like that.
So, uh, essentially we are trying to get this, um,
chat buildup, um, since last late last year,
so, or early last year.
So, um, since she, that's the request.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wish to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I close
the public portion of the meeting.
I'll turn it over to the board for discussion.
But first I'll have Secretary Jersey read the, uh,
impact statement into the record or summarize it at least.
Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Um, per the planning department, um,
It says, um, planning director.
I have requested to review the above-mentioned item
for its impact on the city
and its all impact on the abutting and local thing.
It says on January 13th, 2025,
the petitioner obtained conditional approval
of a minor amendment to the site plan
for Warren among Lions.
Church approved minor amendment is for the addition
of a 30 foot by 50 foot shed.
After reviewing the request, no issues were found
to impact the budding local or general public.
In relation to the addition of the structure attached,
you'll find the planning department's findings
and recommendation as well regarding the variance request
to waive the requirements for a wall
or a green belt screen where it abuts residential districts
or use the planning department makes the following
recommendation per section four D 46
of the zoning ordinance modifications
to non residential requirements
for landscape screenings or natural buffer.
Subsection three states the public benefit intended
by the landscape, screen
or buffer requirements could be better achieved within
an alternative design.
Playing staff has provided an alternative design as follows.
One, provide provide the eight foot wide green bell along
the south property line, beginning at the existing fence up
to the west edge of the parking lot, a distance
of a approximately 380 feet.
There are some trees in Arbor VAs existing in this area
indicate the existing plantings
and include the additional trees
and shrubs to be planted within
the area per the zoning ordinance.
Indicate the green belt on the site.
Plant two along the remaining southwest
and no property lines planting.
Staff would like to see clusters of plantings
that can include trees, shrubs,
and flowers that would provide screening
between the existing use
and the adjacent residential dwellings.
At present, there's not any screening except
for a small section along the south property line.
Some examples are as follows, east eastern, Eastern White,
pine American, Sycamore AEs, Eastern Hemlock Service, Berry,
Eastern Red Bud, sweet Bay, Magnolia,
and our arrowwood Vibram, this is not,
this is not an exhaustive list, indicate the locations
of new plantings, cluster and, and species on the site plan.
And
It looks to be it, it just has the planning department's,
um, recommendations
and all that, which is like three, four pages.
Thank you. At this time I'll turn it over
to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair, Mr. Green,
Uh, question, where do you store your lawn
and, uh, equipment? Right now?
We have a small section of the building right now
that it's enclosed that, uh,
just fits basically two lawnmowers in there.
So we, we need this, um, shed to essentially, uh,
alleviate that this
Pole barn size shed. Yeah,
It's about that size.
So just for clarification, it, it, it,
it's noted in the backup that there's to be no
outside storage around the shed, which is common.
A lot of times people will start outside storage.
So just be clear with that.
The other question I would have is, it was noted by planning
that you have a, a trash dumpster,
existing trash dumpster right now.
Yeah. There's a dumpster on site right now that, uh,
we've been asked to relocate
and, uh, build a, a wall around it.
Yes.
And you, are you willing to do that?
Yeah, we, we've been, we're okay with that. Okay.
Yeah. And the other que the other thing I had was, I mean,
how willing I I I realize that in a property
that big walls are pretty expensive,
but would you be, uh, willing to try to do some of this, uh,
uh, green belt, uh, stuff on the, on some
of the spots that are open?
Definitely to
Help out. I'm just Yeah,
that would be, I think
that would be neighborly if, if you did do that.
Yes. Those are my questions. Thank you,
Mr. Chair.
Mr. Watts, You have a pretty good sized building.
Is there, and you know, I understand that you got a spot
where you're keeping some stuff now.
There's no way you can modify to, to keep
that stuff in the building without putting up a
Yeah, so the building's a very old school building.
Yep. Um, that, um,
the founding members purchased back in the early nineties.
And so to do that you had
to essentially tear down some pretty, um, I guess, uh,
strong foundations, um, to excavate
and, you know, just too much demolition.
Okay. I, I happen to, I happen to live in the area
and I talked, I have talked
to a few of the neighbors about this.
This is a pretty good sized building, you know,
that you wanna put up a pole barn in a residential area.
And quite frankly, I kinda have a problem with that.
It doesn't, to me it doesn't fit the neighborhood.
Um, so I'm in
my mind, have you looked at any other options?
This is the best option.
I mean, I don't know what other options we can do.
Um, again, it's a old school building.
It's got classrooms that we use for Sunday school for, uh,
ministry work, uh,
which was just turned into a church building.
So, I mean, if we had to just, um,
remodel the building, it's, it's a lot more work than
building a shed next to it.
I understand that. And, and I know you got a big piece
of property, but like I said, you're centered right.
In a residential neighborhood
and to put a pole barn up there just doesn't fit.
I mean, you know, years ago the college put one up on, uh,
Barnard South of 12
and it doesn't fit the area there either.
Um, so I just, I have my concerns. Mm-hmm.
Um, I don't know how the rest of my colleagues feel,
but I'm gonna be a no vote on this.
I have a couple, uh, comments to make.
My first comment is, you're on a huge piece of property.
I don't necessarily disagree with, you know,
putting some type of auxiliary, uh, garage or structure shed
or some type of structure for additional storage.
What just concerns me is the, the height I want to ask you,
why does it have to be so tall?
Is it gonna be a two story? Uh,
It's a, it's a one story.
It's just going to be, um, like a, mostly for
lawn equipment, tables, chairs, things like that.
I mean, right now we got snow blowers that are,
you know, in a, in a room.
So we gotta move these things, these things out so we,
we can utilize the rooms for other purposes.
Sure, I understand that.
So how far is the
structure gonna be from the closest wall of the building?
It's not very far. I would say about 10, 15 feet
The most. Okay. That's my other
question. 'cause it doesn't make sense
to put something way out in the field. No,
It's not way out in the middle anywhere. No.
Okay. My only concern really is, is the height
of the structure.
I think 14 feet is kind of high
for auxiliary building in the back.
I also just would wanna see the, the, the arbor on
that south property line shielding the, the neighbors.
What other, uh, comments from the board? Mr.
Chair? Mr. Chair?
You know, I still have a concern.
I think 1500 square feet is huge for an accessory building.
It's a house even with the mount, I mean it's,
it's, it's as big as my house.
Mm-hmm. That's a lot of lawn equipment.
It's snow equipment and other kind
of equipment that you could store in there.
Um, I have no problems with the placement
and all this kind of stuff, but I would love
to see something smaller.
Mm-hmm. Not 1500 square feet.
I kind of ag agree with, uh, Mr. Stevi.
Uh, you know, that was the first thing that stood out
as 1500 square feet's.
A lot of room for just a few lawnmowers,
a snowblower, some tables and chairs.
I mean, it's, it's bigger than
half the houses on the south side, so I,
the square footage kind of throws me for a loop.
Um, everything else I seems to be okay.
But, um, yeah, just I'm
a little question about the size of it. How,
How big is the church building?
Um, approximately?
I don't have, I don't have the approximate size.
Okay. It, It's a former elementary school, I
Believe. Okay. So it's,
it's pretty 23,000, 23,000 square feet. Okay.
It's a huge building is How about parking on Sunday?
Do you have any plan
or cars parking on the lawn at all during No. Do you have
Plenty of, we, we, uh, recently, uh,
expanded our parking lot a bit last couple years,
so we don't have any issues in parking.
Okay. I I, I, we just might have an old bird's eye view
'cause the lot doesn't look very large. Um,
Can I ask the petitioner one question real quick?
Sure. So what, what made you land on the 1500
number of square footage?
How, how did you calculate your, your needs based off of?
Um, again, we have two riding lawnmowers, uh, commercial,
um, lawnmowers.
What's that? The one truck snow plow and a snow plow truck.
So, um,
Oh, so vehicle two?
Yeah. Correct. Okay. Yeah. Okay.
Let's starting to make a little bit sense so that
that fills the space pretty quick with things like that.
So Yeah. At least I have a little better understanding.
So thank you for clarifying.
In the, in the spirit of fairness, I mean, we approve
sheds that are 200 square feet on 1500 square
with a 1500 square foot home if you're going by.
Yeah. Percentages here. 1500 is, is pretty reasonable.
But, um, I understand the concerns some members have.
Are there any other comments from the
board? Mr. Lindsay, do you have
Yeah, I mean, something to add.
I I'm hearing what everybody's saying about the size,
but if I, I think about it and,
and maybe we don't have it here in Warren,
but if you drive north of here
and you start seeing some, these really large churches,
I think you'll see some of this kind
of thing on their property.
Uh, I don't think this is uncommon.
You guys have a very, um, large building, so it, it,
it seems to make sense that you might need that space
and might even grow into that space.
Um, I've definitely driven past churches, large churches
that, that have these types of things.
Um, so I, I would support this, um, with, with the, uh,
with the trees and, and the landscaping.
Thank You. My, my only other concern is
that I know obviously there's gonna be electricity.
Is that gonna be a heated, a cooled structure,
or is there gonna be plumbing out there?
No plumbing. Um, at the moment, um, we do plant
Electricity, but then maybe later on down the
Road. Okay. That's,
I, I personally don't have a problem with it
as presented as long as those, uh, green belt items are,
uh, taken into consideration and added into the plan.
Um, I'm just, I, I don't, I, I don't wanna see
that become of, of residence, though.
I wanna see that building used for the purposes
that you're presenting it as.
Any other comments from the board?
You have one more Mr. Green?
So this is probably a good time that we it up.
So when I was driving around and, uh,
and this is in reference to, uh,
the dumpster and the dumpster enclosure.
I was driving around this week. I counted, where is it?
17 dumpster enclosures
and only six of them were, had dumpsters in them.
So I would urge you to use, use your dumpster enclosure
because it's, it's a problem.
I just use that to bring it up this time.
So, sorry. Go ahead. I'm good.
Thank you. Any other comments about this or motions?
I,
I would make a motion, but I'm not sure how to word it
with the, the green belt, is it just as it's written?
Um, or you could put with, um, uh, the recommendations
for planning, um, for the green belt, um, as recommend
or for the green belt as recommended by planning.
Okay. So don't read off bullet 0.5,
but replace it with the recommendations from planning.
Correct? Correct.
Okay. Gimme one second and I'll make a motion real.
Okay. I would like to make a motion, uh,
to grant the petitioner, uh, permission to
allow the expansion of a non-conforming church
by constructing an accessory structure
with the following conditions.
One 30 foot by 50 foot, uh, totaling 1500 square feet,
two 14 feet in height at the eaves accessory structure.
Three outside of the side building lines
of the principal building also to four.
Uh, continue nonconforming use of a church,
not any major thefor thoroughfare,
but would take the planning department's recommendation
to add greenbelt screening.
Um, due to the size and shape of the lot,
and I don't think it'll be a detriment to the area.
Do we have a comment or Did
A message up? Yes. Um,
I believe you also need to read number five in,
Well, number five was the, um,
recommendation for planning.
We replaced number five with implementing the green belt.
Implementing the green belt.
I believe you still need to read number five
because it's, it's a church in a residential area.
Oh, the first part of it? Yes.
Okay. Uh, so to add onto the, the motion number five,
continue the non-conforming use of a church with a wall
or greenbelt screening
where sight a buts residential district
or uses while taking the planning department's
recommendation to add greenbelt screening.
There we go. Perfect. Do we have a support?
I'll support it. We have a motion by Mr. Lindsay,
support by Secretary of Jersey
to approve the request is read.
Mr. Lindsay? Uh,
yes. For a reason. State in the motion.
Mr. Jersey votes Yes. For a reason. State in the motion.
Mr. Assessor.
No. I believe it would be a countryman.
Mr. Green? Yes. For the reason.
State of the Motion, Mr. Watts?
No, I think it's a detriment to the neighborhood. Mr.
Starch?
Um, yes. For the reason stated in motion
Chair Safaria Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion. May have five. Yep.
Your request has been approved. Thank
You. Thank you.
This brings us to item 13.
Item 13. Applicant Jonathan,
aka Representative Jonathan aka.
Common description. 2 4 8 0 0 Hoover branch requested
permission to one, conduct a temporary outdoor retail sales
operation without a permanent building.
Two. Conduct a temporary outdoor sales operation in a 30
foot by 30 foot 900 square foot tent in an area designated
for parking from 9:00 AM to 9:00 PM June 21st, 2025
through July 6th, 2025.
Good evening. Good evening. Good evening.
Board members. Uh, Karen Birdie on behalf of Jonathan Saka.
My address is 2 8 2 2 5 Mound Road, Warren,
Michigan 4 8 0 9 2.
Mr. Saka is here to my left.
And, uh, will you confirm for the board that you've asked me
to represent you tonight?
Yes, I've asked Karen to represent tonight.
Thank you. I had him, uh, do that
because it's not on the affidavit
that was submitted. May I proceed
Please? Okay.
Um, Board members, this is a site
that was often done by Pat Saka
and it was a site for fireworks in the exact same fashion
as being presented today that, uh, pat Saka had submitted,
it's gotta be 20 plus years, um,
that he did fireworks at this site in the exact same way.
Unfortunately, pat Saka passed away last August.
And, um, this is his nephew, Jonathan Saka.
He's been doing fireworks with his uncle Pat Saka
for the last 15 years.
Basically his right hand man.
And now, um, Jonathan has taken over to do the fireworks,
uh, to support, uh, the Saka family, um, his, uh,
uh, aunt and, uh, the granddaughter.
Um, this is at Value Fresh, uh, market.
My client proposes to have a 30
by 30 tent from 21st through July 6th,
um, for, uh, legal, uh, fireworks from 9:00 AM to 9:00 PM
The June 21st is, is to allow for setup time.
His inspection date will be June 25th,
so sales won't really start probably till the 26th.
That, that location. So it'll be sales
from, and that's accurate.
Yeah, from the 26th, uh, to the, uh,
uh, fourth.
And then he'll be, uh, cleaning up, uh, that site.
Um, the record of Pat Saka
and Jonathan Saka, when they've done fireworks
with the state is excellent.
They do not have a record of violations or non-compliance,
and we're available for any questions that you might have.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I close the public portion of the meeting
and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair, before we get started on this one, I work
probably a quarter mile from here.
Is there any issues for me to be a part of this discussion?
No, that's your only, Hmm, that's, you don't work
for the owner of the facility or
No, just location. Okay.
That's no problem. Okay,
No problem. I wanted to clarify. Thank
you.
I'm not a huge fan of firework or not firework tents,
but I'm not a huge fan of tents in general.
But I usually I'll grant them
for the temporary fireworks just
because it's only up for, for two weeks.
It's in my mind a little less, uh, um,
detrimental to the neighborhood.
'cause it's not up for, you know, four or five months.
It's just up for two weeks. It's, it's quick.
And they have a good record at that location.
Mr. Chair. Um, gonna go on the record as stating again,
my, um, um, my disapproval for fireworks tents in town.
I also believe it takes away from the businesses in town
that are trying to do the right thing
by having their own brick and mortar.
I think it undercuts, uh, businesses
that are actually still paying insurance
and, um, paying property taxes on, on said business.
I'm sure Mr. Saka is, is a fine, fine young gentleman.
Um, but this is, uh,
this has been my line in the
sand since I've been on the board.
Um, I, you know,
the reason there's probably such great compliance is
because there's no inspection during that time.
Um, you know, these things pop up,
everybody's gone on their holiday weekends
and, you know, short of the first initial inspection,
there's no, there's no, there's no follow ups.
So, um, and then to, to boot, you know, my, my,
my past displeasure with the way tanks,
tents are anchored in this town
and trying to get some kind of tent ordinance,
um, established.
So we can try and avoid this every year would be nice.
But, um, I'm always gonna be against these, as far
as I'm concerned, anytime they come up,
Mr. Chair,
I, uh, I feel the same way.
I'm, I'm generally not gonna be in favor of
fireworks displays outside, uh, for the same reasons.
Um, you know, I live in the city.
I, I see these things go up.
They're usually not in compliance from
what's voted on and approved.
Um, I, I do personally think they are a detriment,
um, to the area.
So I I, I will have known.
Are there other comments from the board? Mr. Chair?
Uh, I would like to ask the petitioner,
did you have something you'd like to add?
Yes, I am concerned that, uh, the board thinks
that there are no inspections.
That is not what occurs.
And in fact, the state fire marshal's
office is in charge of them.
I don't think I said that because I did not say that.
I said that the short of the, I said short
of the first inspection, I don't, I don't believe they're,
they're there every day, every week.
Sorry, just don't,
If I can, if I can explain, I represent many
fireworks vendors
and have for probably the last 15 or so years.
And at one point I owned a fireworks company.
I have since sold that. I happened
to have opened fireworks tents throughout Wayne Oakland
and Macomb County, um, probably for about 10 years in a row.
The way that it is, uh, set up is
there is an initial inspection,
and it's done by Lansing, uh, fire Marshal from Lansing.
They're assigned small areas
and they set up a date when they're gonna come and they come
and they go through the entire, um, three pages
of what's required to be able to have
that firework tent set up.
In addition to that, the city is always,
because it's a tent within their city, welcome
to come and inspect.
Um, the, we're open to that. Um, they can do that.
In addition to that, not only do they do that,
but they come back around several times.
They have actually tried to have miners by fireworks
and test the system.
Um, they've actually, um, checked the fireworks themselves.
Like when they first checked the fireworks at the first
inspection, it is not uncommon that they come back again
and check the fireworks.
This is, um, uh, the protocol that goes on.
I have had fireworks vendors get tickets
for blocking exits when they wanted to control the pathway
through their tent for violating, uh, closing exit.
So I know they're out there doing enforcement
because I end up representing them on their,
uh, violation tickets.
The good news is the AKAs have never had
those violation tickets.
Um, they run a very clean, um,
operation following all the rules.
The other thing I heard about was insurance.
The state law mandates a million dollar insurance policy,
which I said nothing about insurance,
Said nothing. I had no nothing
to say stated about insurance.
I'm just talking about brick and mortar shops
that pay their taxes, pay insurance on their property,
year in and year out, month
after month, only to be undercut by these tents that pop up
and undercut their business.
Same thing with flower peddlers that come in,
undercut their business.
I, I had nothing to do, no comments about insurance,
about his tent or nothing.
So you don't twist my words, Ms. Birdie.
I'm not saying that this, I was just trying to show
Positive things, but we don't need it.
I, I don't need any, any more information unless else
I wasn't trying to be disrespectful in saying you
said that there is an insured.
You're, you're just twisting my words
that I don't appreciate that, ma'am.
Thank you.
Are there other comments from the board tonight? Yeah, Mr.
Mr. Green. So my question is for Mr. Walter Ponds.
So we, this is kind of a round and round thing.
So like we have an existing piece of property on, uh,
on 13 mile and Mound where their tent is actually, so
that, that's a good point.
That something that needs to be,
I don't even know if there's a height requirement
where their particular tent is higher than the business, uh,
signage behind it.
So when you brought that up, I thought about that,
but my more specific question of this item is,
and we, you, you spoke about this
before, so does a sign, does the ability to advertise
with a sign that's not on, not on the,
on the structure itself,
but like, uh, oh, I call 'em circus signs at one point.
You said that some, sometimes those go along with some
of these, uh, these items.
Does it, um, would there, do they
Give if, if there is a, uh, Well,
It might, they're not required to have a CFC If the
property owner requests a temporary sign can
be put in place.
There is a fee and a permit required.
You mean the petitioner, Right.
Petitioner. This part. Okay. Yeah.
So it doesn't automatically come with this approval.
Doesn't, auto signs do not come automatically.
Signs don't come automatically with site plans
or building plans or anything signs.
So where I see stand on their own,
So where I see signs, that means
that somewhere along this process, someone approved the sign
Or they put it up illegally. Alright,
Thank you Mr.
While you're there, I have another one question.
Sometimes we see the flower stands go through, um, planning
to get just a, like a, a, I don't know,
like a one time approval
where they can do the tent annually.
Are you familiar with that?
Um, outdoor sales areas require site plan approval.
Okay. As this fireworks has gone through site plan.
Well, it's been there for a while,
but it had gone
through site plan approval at some point in time.
Okay. So there's no way to just go
through planning at one time to get a, a, a yearly,
you know, two week temporary license?
Well, to, To pick the, there would be if you went
for permanent outdoor sales, if
that's the question I believe
You're asking. Okay. But that's
not through the, that's not something
through the planning department.
It would go back to zoning for a, for a permanent
No. Planning.
Planning would, outdoor planning has the authority
to do permanent outdoor sales on
and established with the,
with a timeframe frame, brick and mortar there.
Okay. And this is temporary where it
doesn't meet those conditions. Right.
Okay. That makes sense. To
Piggyback on that, if I may, so
we talked about this earlier.
So this is where the, and this is not specific to this item,
but why we're talking about it.
So we talked about this earlier.
So there's a, a lot of these particular items
that we've discussed are obviously, are, are obviously, uh,
site plan violations.
So in the process we have planning,
and that's where the site plans are approved.
But outside of that planning has no enforcement tool.
They don't have any people who do enforcement.
And when it, and, and when we talked about, uh,
property maintenance, property maintenance,
even though it's supposed to be more residential, it seems
to lean more towards businesses.
So once these site plans get approved,
it just seems like there's no,
people just run wild with what they're doing.
And so that's a general problem.
The, the, the process with the site plan is
they go through it, they do send an inspector out.
The inspector if they find anything, issues a letter
to the building department, which zoning takes over
and would follow up with enforcement of non-compliance
with the site plan within the zoning ordinance,
property must comply with the site plan.
So we do have that authority zoning doesn't go out
and look to see if anyone is complying with
site plans on a daily basis.
We don't have the manpower or the time for
That. Right. And that's, this is the discussion
from the day,
because obviously this is not a,
this is not a priority of our administration. It,
It's not, I cannot speak on that behalf.
I know you can't, but I can't, it's not a priority.
Planning should have enforcement a tool.
Property maintenance should have more people
and zoning should have more people.
Or what happens is, what people on this board have been
complaining about for since I've been here is
that the wagons are falling off the damn wheel
and nobody's doing anything about it.
And this is not you, I'm talking about generally speaking.
I understand. So the first thing I've learned is
that this is not a priority for the administration.
So that answers my questions. Thank you.
You're welcome. I'm a little concerned
that we might be talking about things that aren't this item.
We, yeah. Can I, can I say, can I, can I say something?
We're not asking for temporary signage.
Um, that's not a situation that we're gonna be doing.
Um, with regard to, um, site plans,
I end up representing clients consistently
who get letters from the building department
that they're not in compliance with, uh, their site plan.
And often work to either bring them back through the process
to get them in compliance through planning
and sometimes through zoning, but otherwise,
or clean up the situation to have them fully understand
what their site plan is.
So whereas we've been through site plan
before, the site plan that you're seeing is exactly what we,
uh, intend to comply with exactly as it's on here.
So if you went out there, it should look exactly,
um, like that. If,
If I, if I could just summarize,
this has been here for 20 years.
Obviously there's been no violations that we see.
The people in the brick and mortar storefronts aren't
complaining because if they didn't like the guy,
they would complain to the landlord
because the landlord's in control of the property.
Uh, this to me is just the same request that's been there.
You know, that's been asked for the last at least 15 years.
Are there other comments from the board?
Ms. Birdie, is there anything else you wanna add?
Yes, please. In addition to doing the tie down straps,
my client does the water weights.
He does four of them at each corner.
These water weights weigh 458 pounds each, each one
of those water weights, um,
and is attached to the corners in addition
to the tie down ropes that go into the ground.
Um, so he has been, I believe in compliance with, um,
uh, recommendations by this board in the past.
So they're willing to comply with that.
It's my understanding the concrete's only 400 pounds,
so this is 58 pounds more.
Um, um, as as stated, um, the
location that we're at is one brick and mortar building.
They don't do fireworks. They're pleased to have, um, Mr.
Saka, uh, do the fireworks
and there are no other, um, entities there.
It is the market fresh value,
value fresh market.
And, um, as stated, they're the only ones in that location.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Mr. Woods. If
There's no other discussion, I'd like to make a motion.
Please do. I'd like to make a motion
to approve the petitioner's request to one,
conduct a temporary outdoor retail sales operation without a
permanent building, and two,
conduct a temporary outdoor sales operation in a 30
by 3,900 square foot tent in an area designated
for parking from 9:00 AM to 9:00 PM June 21st, 2025
through July 6th, 2025.
Reason being the size
and shape of the lot, not detriment to neighborhood.
Do we have a support? Support? We have a motion by Mr.
Neitz that was support by Mr. Green. Green. Green, yep.
To, to approve the request as read
Mr. Svi?
Yes. For reason stated in Motion. Mr. Green? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Watts? Yes. For the reason stated
Motion, Mr. Lindsey?
No. Uh, I believe it's self-imposed.
It's economic and I do believe it's a detriment to the area.
Mr. Assessor? Yes.
For the reasons stated in the motion.
Mr. Jersey votes? No.
I believe it's a detriment to the area. Chairman Sefa?
Yes. For the reasons stated in the motion.
Thank you. That's five. It's been approved. Thank you.
Thank you. This brings us
to item 14.
Item 14. Applicant Moha Mohammad AB Abdul rub
representative Mohammad Abdul rub common description.
1 5 1 5 0 14 mile variances requested permission two one.
Install 18. 18 foot by 17.
Seven foot 10
by 10.5 square foot wall sign in addition
to existing 20.56 square feet and 19 square feet.
Wall signs two installed.
864 square feet of design element to gas canopy three.
Install 103.90 square feet of signage to five gas pumps side
of pump balances to remain white for a total
of 1017 0.96 square feet of wall signage.
Good evening. Good evening.
If you could please state your name
and address for the record.
Mohamad AB Rob. 3 3 0 4 Me Drive, Michigan.
Thank you. Tom Tamu.
And Your address? 3 1 0 2 Farmdale Drive,
Sterling Heights, Michigan.
Thank you. Please tell us about your request.
So we built a new gas station there in the corner
and, um, the business, um,
has been approved for a liquor license
and also for gasoline cells
and retail store.
Um, so these businesses need signs
as everyone knows.
Um, and that's what we had
to wait so long.
Although the business is open now already.
Um, but they're operating
with a temporary sign on the street
until the official one comes in.
Uh, we have a beautiful sign coming in, um,
that was approved already.
Uh, we're just waiting for the faces
because they're special made, uh,
for this company called s and g.
Um, they own quite a few gas stations, uh,
82 gas stations.
They just purchased four more.
One of them was ours and they just purchased seven more
after the purchase that, so they're, they're, you know,
quite coming to town and we would like to welcome them
and show them that, you know, uh,
and we have, it's a beautiful building.
I've everyone been out there. Yeah.
So please help us provide beautiful signs for it.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I close the public portion of the meeting
and turn it over to the board for discussion.
Mr. Chair. Mr. Watts.
So the temporary sign that's up on the hill,
on the corner out there, that's just
temporary that's coming back down?
Correct. Okay.
Um, very nice job on the development. Thank you.
Looks a lot better than those two
abandoned structures that was there.
I agree. Um, but I came by there tonight
and I have a real problem.
I bet you spot the grass.
It looks horrible. I know your sod looks good up on the
hill, but all the way around.
I was like, I lost my mind.
I I did too, but let me explain that.
Uh, so that's a brand new sod and we cannot cut it.
They won't allow us to cut it until it seals
between the grass and the top soil.
And it looks like,
Yeah. You
should see my other properties. They're all cut.
I have vacant property for, I don't know,
maybe 20, 26 years now.
I've been, I've been looking for a tenant for over, uh,
somewhere on 10 Mile Road, but I cut it.
Yeah. Even though it's been vacant, but I understand.
I I don't like that either.
Of course, grass cannot be high for any type of business,
but we cannot cut it right now.
We have to wait until it seals
otherwise they won't guarantee it.
Okay. I, 'cause I know the sod looks good on, on this,
on the side of the sidewalk to the building,
but outside between the walk
and the curb, like I say, it looks horrible
and then down by the wall
to the west side of the property, so.
Right. I wish. Okay. As long as, as long as
that's not gonna be a
pattern, I don't have a problem with it.
Oh no. Nobody builds buildings like this and leaves.
No, it, it's very,
it's very nice. It's very nice. Thank you,
Mr. Chair,
Secretary Jersey. I'm good. Um,
we've come a long way on
this project, haven't we, sir? Yes.
Yes we have. Um,
So yeah, I, the, the one question I have, you get,
you're asking for two liquor signs, is that? Yes.
Well, it's two sides of the building.
One on Hayes and one on 14 miles. Yeah.
Right. I, me personally, beautiful building.
I think the one on Hayes is just a little bit extra.
I think. I think no people
are gonna know you're selling liquor.
You got the, the bigger one on the front.
People are gonna be drawn into the new building, you know,
you know, just by matter of fact,
I mean, I can't see how they're not.
So, um, that's the only thing I see in this.
I think everything else is fine.
But, you know, just to have that nice face of that side of
that building on Hayes, just have a liquor sign up there,
just to me, just kind of, I don't know.
But that's just me personally. So, um, I
Would echo that.
It's a beautiful building.
I think the, the signage for the gas pumps
and the awning that all routine gas station
stuff, I have no problem with that.
I have a little bit of a problem with the liquor sign.
I just, it's such a beautiful building.
It's a shame to put, you know, it makes it look cheap to
have liquor so prominent on the building.
Um, if that's what you guys wanna do.
I, I, I guess I could support it.
I just don't wanna see Budweiser and other Yeah.
Beer and liquor advertisements in the window,
because, you know, that's what a lot of places do.
So I, I understand what you're saying.
Um, uh,
but, you know, these, these places, they have
to advertise their stuff in order to, you know,
that's what they all do.
Sure. Um, so,
You know, they sometimes they do a little more taly.
They go food, snacks, liquor beer.
It's not just liquor y. You know what I mean?
It just, that, that was my
Liquor comment. I kind of agree.
I mean, I think you're gonna end up having
window elements in there, you know, I mean, at some point,
whether it's advertising for a special sale
or something that's coming along, I mean, for people
probably know that, you know, you're selling, you know,
alcohol in, in there.
So just me personally, I mean, you know, to remove the 18
by seven, um, I would like to see,
but if you're, if you're against that,
then you're against it.
So it's, so,
So, uh, we're not done
because there's roki chicken and pizza.
Correct. They're also coming there
and they would like to have some type of sign also.
Right. So, but that's coming in the future with Steve.
They're working with Steve on that. I'm sure.
Am I correct, Steve?
I did talk to a rep from either Rokey or Sign Company.
It sounds like they're gonna come in within the ordinance,
so they won't be before you, so Oh, okay.
They, they're, they're looking
to put two 20 square foot signs.
They'll have their CFC, they're allowed 40 square footage,
and they already have a spot that will be on the ground sign
that was already approved by you guys. Yes,
I remember. Yes. Correct.
Thanks, Mr.
Chair, if I may for a question for Mr.
Steve, I've got a question for you while you're there.
Yes, sir. Window signage. Yes.
Since it came up, is there anything in the ordinance that,
in the ordinances that says yes or no on that?
Yes, you are allowed, if it's illuminated,
you're allowed 25%
of the window to be illuminated.
If it's non illuminated, you're allowed 50%.
A permit is required for, well, one permit can obtain
all the windows on the property, so it's $25 per window.
So if they had 10 windows, if it's 50% of each window pane,
we would approve that and it would cost them
$250 and go from there.
Okay. I just, since it came up
and I, no problem. Some. Okay. Thank you.
I try to answer you guys question as quick
and as honestly as I can. We gotta
Keep you sharp, Steve. Just trying to
Keep you sharp.
I, I, you know, they, they know
what they're doing i's not my favorite thing,
having the liquor on the side, but, um, they do a good job
and I trust that they'll keep the windows tasteful.
Thank you. Any other comments from the board,
Mr. Chair? If there's no other
comments, I'd like
to make a motion, please
Do. I'd
like to grant permission, uh, to the
one install 18 inch by seven foot 10
and a half, I'm sorry.
10.5 square foot wall sign in addition
to existing 20.56 square feet and 19 square feet.
Wall signs to install 864 square feet of design element
to gas canopy three.
Install 103.9 square feet of signage to five gas pumps,
sides of pump balances to remain white for a total
of 1017 0.96 square feet of wall signage.
Uh, due to the fact that it's not a detriment to the area
Support, We have a motion by Mr. Lindsay.
Support by Mr. Assessor to approve. The request is read
Mr. Lindsay Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion Mr.
Assessor? Yes. For the reasons stated in the motion.
Mr. Green? Yes. For the reason stated in the motion.
Mr. Watts? Yes. For the reasons stated the motion Mr.
Starch Yes. Yes. For the reason stated motion, Mr.
Jersey votes Yes.
For the reason stated the motion Chairman sfa Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion,
your request has been approved. Thank you
So much. Thank you
so much. Thank you.
Have A nice day.
This brings us to item 15. Whoops.
Your throne paperclips.
Applicant mc Development Holdings.
LLC Derek Reba, representative James Doman.
Common description, 2 0 0 3
and 2 0 0 5 12 mile branch has requested permission
to erect a eight foot high, 16 foot
by 35 foot dumpster screen walls.
Good evening. Good evening. My name is Ryan Schultz.
I'm the development Director for Skill Con Gold.
We are Sheets development partner in southeast Michigan.
I also have with me tonight Nancy Standish.
She is our engineer and we are
before you seeking a variance from the ordinance
for the height of our trash enclosure.
Uh, the typical sheets prototypical trash
enclosures, eight feet in height.
The current ordinance limits that height to six feet.
Um, we primarily do this to make sure that
all trash containers are completely 100% screened,
non-visible to the public.
Um, so we are here tonight
before you to ask for that dimensional variance to allow us
to build an eight foot high trash
enclosure at this location.
Thank you for those comments. This is a public hearing.
Is there anyone in the audience
who wishes to speak on this item?
Not seeing anyone. I'll turn it over
to the board for discussion. Mr.
Chair. Mr. Neitz? Hold on
A second. Oh,
oh, we're gonna read the,
at least summarize the planning impact statement. Yeah.
Thanks Mr. Chair. Sorry, Mr. Starch.
Um, there's, um, from the planning department, it says,
after review of the request, no issues were found
to impact the budding local or general public.
Um, there's also a, um,
pretty lengthy thing from, um, it looks like the,
the lawyer, um, Kirk
and Mente just basically summarizes, um,
the applicant's variance request, um,
regarding the walls, all the dimensions.
Um, it's pretty lengthy, um,
regarding local authorities, app application, um,
the explanation of the applicant's request, um,
and so on and so forth.
So, um, that's,
but there's nothing really detrimental that I'm seeing in,
in this report, um, that, um, that creates
And everyone has a copy.
Yeah. And everybody has a copy.
Um, and that's all, that's all I have. So Mr.
Mr. Sitz, you have the floor.
Okay. Thank you.
I can tell you I was a little surprised
'cause I didn't realize you guys were building that one
until I got the package and Yeah.
You know, that's like walking distance from my house.
But, um, I mean, I'm familiar with the sheets,
locations in the, in other states and so, so forth.
The enclosure being eight foot high instead of six foot
actually just screens it all a lot better.
I personally think it's a good thing on the property, so.
Sure. And we're familiar with the other, uh,
sheet location we approved.
They were eight foot dumpster enclosure.
Your lawyers wrote a super brief.
I don't know how many hours they have
into that, but they did a great job. We,
We do pay those bills.
And that is a rather lengthy letter. Yes,
Yes. It's,
I I, I bet get
Those Hours. I
have, uh, no objections. Is there a motion I'd
Like chair? Mr. Watts?
I have a question. Sure.
So this was on, uh, planning on Monday night,
and it was postponed, it was not approved.
So my question is,
should we be voting on this tonight and approving it?
Because as I understand, a variance goes with the property
and let's just say that something
happened and they didn't build.
Now you got this variance setting there.
That's that's a true, it's A true statement, true
Consideration. Right. So I'm,
I'm concerned about this.
I'm, Steve could probably answer.
I think it's probably gonna happen, but I'm
just, I don't wanna do the wrong thing. Steve can answer.
Mr. Cheon, do you have any clarity?
Well, I, I was coming up to clarify that I discussed it
with people above
and everything, whether it should move forward or not,
and they see no reason.
But as I came up to here, I, I thought about it a little bit
and I said, you guys have the permission
and the ability to be put a condition on that,
that if it is approved by the site plan, by the,
um, planning commission.
Mm-hmm. So you can put that condition on there.
So it would be contingent today, but once approved, it would
Contingent on planning approval,
Planning commission Approval. That
makes sense. You know, if this was something more
complex, you know, maybe I would be apt to do that, but,
And I don't, and usually we would probably say we
want it removed.
If it was more complex,
I can't mm-hmm. I can't think of
any use for that property
where I would not want an eight foot tall.
Right. Dumpster enclosure. Yes.
So it's a win-win either way.
Some of the neighbors.
Does that answer your question, sir?
Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Watts, there's no other questions.
I'm prepared to make a motion. Please
Do. Okay.
I'd like to make a motion to allow him
to erect an eight foot high, 16 foot
by 35 foot dumpster screen wall.
And it's contingent on, uh,
the project getting approved and moving forward.
Support. We have a motion by Mr. Watts, support by Mr.
Assessor to approve the request is read
Mr. Watts?
Yes. Mr. Assessor? Yes.
For the reason stated in the motion. Mr. Lindsay? Yes.
Mr. Green? Yes. For the reason stated in the motion. Mr.
Starch? Yes. For reason stated in the motion. Mr.
Jersey votes? Yes. For reason
stated in motion chair Mr. Aya?
Yes. For the reason stated in the motion
request has been approved.
Thank you very much. Thank You.
Can, can you guys get one of those open like soon?
Absolutely. Absolutely. We're doing everything we can.
Uh, demo starts on the pompous lane site
within the next couple weeks. Okay. Oh,
Great. Cool. You know, I didn't have
a chance
to look very closely at the site plan.
Is that car lot in the front, is that being acquired?
That's still there. That's still gonna be there.
The, those conversations are ongoing.
I know everyone likes to bring,
What about the carpet and the bowling alley to the,
The carpet is gone.
Okay. The bowling alley is remaining. Okay.
Um, we are in negotiations
or have made attempts to negotiate with the car lot owner.
Uh, we are rekindling some of those conversations
because the price got going up and up
and, uh Sure.
Which it's inevitable. Right.
So we're doing everything we can to try
to rectify that situation.
Thank you. Well, good luck. Thank you.
This brings us to item 17, new business.
Any new business to share?
Mr. Chair, Mr. Watts
For Mr. Watt Pine,
I guess only Mr. Green brought up some stuff
earlier and I,
I'll use a couple of good examples.
I brought this up when I was ex-officio from council
to the planning commission about new projects.
And they, they base the project.
You know, the, the site plan has things that are included,
irrigation, shrubbery, grass, so on and so forth.
And we make those people put that in there
and I think it's a reasonable to expect them to use
that stuff and to take care of their property.
Now here's a great example of who is not doing that.
As a Circle K on Van D**e, north
of 11 Mile, the place looks horrible.
Their shrubs are dead. Half the shrubs are dead.
The grass is outta control half the time.
And then there's a new place at 10 Mile
and Shaner, uh, Northeast Corner Oil change,
beautiful job, put all the shrubs in
the irrigation and everything.
Shrubs are all dead and the grass is a foot high.
How do we get a handle on this?
Um, again, basically if it's something required
by the site plan, it's planning,
that would have to go out there.
They do bond inspections afterwards.
Um, if it's dead shrubs
or something that was on that site plan, uh, then it is
required, then it can be required that it be replaced.
I actually did enforcement on the Tim Hortons at 12
and Band D**e because they chopped down all their trees.
They replaced it. I don't know if they replaced it a hundred
percent, but they did replace some of that.
And planning hasn't said anything,
but it did come from planning first
before zoning got involved.
So it's actually planning and their assistant planners
and stuff like that will go out
and look at it to see if it complies
with the approved site plan.
All right. That, that answers the question.
So I'm just, I'm concerned about, you know,
things were let go for so long in the city,
and now with the new administration and Mr.
Mazare, I know that everybody is really upbeat about trying
to get things done, but it's just disappointing driving
around and seeing this, this mess.
If it is related to open storage,
that is one thing we will look
to see if it complies with the site plan.
But most other things
Okay. That aren't
specific to the zoning
ordinance, we don't look for.
Okay. Appreciate that
Mr. Chair.
Mr. Green.
So I, we, we, we talked about this previous.
The, the problem really is your, your, uh,
work, the amount of people you have.
So planning doesn't have enforcement people,
I mean, per se, they don't have
Enforcement per, per se, right?
They, they have the zoning department
And you have Yeah. And you
only have seven.
Correct. And building property maintenance is,
is like a different animal,
but I think that's more in
line with what you're talking about.
But the problem again, is in order for anything to get done,
we, there's have to be more employees, right.
And that's gonna have to be an administrative decision as to
what they think is important.
I mean, going to events
or making sure the city doesn't look like a rat hole.
So I feel for you.
Thank you, Mr. Mr. Chair. I was waiting for a question.
I was hoping I didn't have to answer
Mr. Chair
to Mr. Green's comment.
Um, you know, I've been, since I've been involved
with the city and on this board
and paying attention to the budget every year, I,
I tell 'em, you gotta increase it.
At least double it. Double every department.
I mean, for a city this size to think seven people are going
to catch everything and you're doing a great job,
but everybody in your department does a great job,
but they're overwhelmed.
I mean, it comes to a point, the overwhelmness becomes,
okay, now how, how, how much am I making a difference?
So it grinds you down.
And you know, this man has never been ground down.
He, he cares about the city
and there's a lot of people in his department
and property maintenance that do.
It's just like you said, you need more manpower.
There's nobody doing follow up. We grant variances.
There's a, there's a, um, a place, I think first, one
of the first things I granted was the screen
enclosure on Shady Lane.
The guy with the wall that thing's still sitting
to this day, same as is.
And I mean, we granted the variance for him years ago.
So there's nobody to, I mean, he's overwhelmed.
You can't, there's only so many people to do.
There's only so many hours in the day.
You know, he's putting out whatever fires he's got to
during the day, but they need two, three people just doing
consistent follow up.
And, and you know, so I mean, I've been trying to champion
that from, to anybody who's gonna hear, you know,
every department needs two, three people.
It's gonna pay for itself. It really will.
But we're gonna keep trying. We're gonna work on
That in any, in any event, we're lucky to have Mr. Eron.
Yes, sir. Absolutely.
Thank you all, you're all so kind for the most part.
Just two quick things before we adjourn.
I wanna bring to your attention the special meeting.
We called for June 4th at 7:30 PM It's a special meeting
that should go relatively quick.
There's nine, there's gonna be 19 items,
but they're all the same, basically.
Right, Nicole? Okay.
And the other thing is, on Monday,
you probably got the invitation already to the, uh,
council of Commissions dinner.
Um, unfortunately I'm gonna be outta town that night,
but I, I hope those that go have a nice time.
Other than that, ready to adjourn. Make
A motion to adjourn support Meeting.
Adjourn nine 17.