Represent.
I'm now calling to order a regular meeting
of the City council, Tuesday,
October 14th, 2025 at 7:00 PM Please
stand for the Pledge of Allegiance.
I pledge allegiance, pledge allegiance to the flag flag
of the United States of America,
and to the Republic for which it stands.
One Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice.
Roll call Madam Secretary Councilwoman Rogan C.
Here. Councilman Dwyer. Here. Councilwoman McGee. Here.
Councilman Bokey. Present. Councilman Nunan. Present.
Councilman Lafferty. Here. Councilwoman Moore is present.
We have a quorum. Next item.
Next item is adoption of the consent agenda. So moved.
Support Lafferty.
Discussion, hearing, and seeing none.
I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee?
Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is adoption of the agenda.
So moved with discussion. Support Lafferty.
Discussion Ms. Moore. Thank you.
Um, we have, um, one item to add.
It is a resolution, um, adopting towing storage
and administrative fees for regulated wrecker,
um, vehicles.
And I will pass these down.
There's
3, 2, 2, 3, 4.
Um, also, um, I'd like to add an item, um,
regarding, um,
city commissions and mayoral appointments
under council business.
Madam Secretary, where is the, uh, resolution?
The resolution will be under,
under council business.
It will be item G
and the commissions will be my item H.
Any other discussion,
hearing and seeing none?
I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Uh, Mr. Nunan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is calendar of pending matters. Six.
A motion to receive and file support.
Ty, any discussion, Hearing, and scene? None.
I'll call the question. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Any opposed?
Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is seven a approval of the bills
of the General Revenue funds.
So moved with discussion support,
property discussion Ms. Moore?
Um, yes. Um, Madam Chair,
check number 6 8 4 6 4 4
should be removed.
Um, that item was originally on the list of bills,
but, um, there was a $150 discount if
we use the city's credit card.
So we switched the payment to the credit card
and that will, that credit card bill will come on a
future list of bills.
So this was a cost savings measure, so I would make a motion
and with that exclusion of that check.
Okay. Uh, Mr.
Lafferty, do you support that Without objection. Thank you.
Any other discussion? Hearing and seeing none?
I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is seven B.
Approval of the bills of the water
and sewer systems. So moved.
Support Dwyer.
Discussion, hearing, and scene?
None. I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Dwyer?
Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is audience participation
for agenda items only.
Members of the audience who would like
to address city Council this evening may do so
by filling out an audience form located
on the right side of the stage.
This is for agenda items only, and you have three minutes.
There is time at the end of the meeting
for general audience.
First up is Lori Harris.
Hi, Lori Harris. I, um, am, uh, wanting
to talk about item HH
and I apologize, I was busy chatting in the back
and I didn't hear if you removed
that from the CAS consent agenda.
Um, no, we didn't. You didn't? Oh, good.
Well, I hope that there were a lot
of questions asked about this.
That's a lot of money in the a DA budget
to put six bathrooms in a kitchen
in the wastewater treatment building.
Now, I, I've never been there,
so I don't know the conditions,
but I went to the a DA, uh, presentation
and I've been kind of involved in a DA things.
And the first goal of the money is to get
to the building, to be able to park and enter the doors.
The second goal, I believe, is to get
to the services inside.
So that building, I'm not sure what it's used,
I mean, if, if people are going in
to do business in the wastewater treatment building,
but I'm also wondering why a kitchen is getting used, built,
renovated with a DA money.
That seems a little bit unusual and maybe inappropriate.
If there's $3 million being spent, then
that's one sixth of the budget.
Um, and I'm guessing that $555,000
could be divided up into other, uh, projects.
Uh, so that's the first thing.
The second thing is just a, a reminder that
when we keep giving permission
for these marijuana businesses to extend their licenses
because they didn't get their paperwork done, et cetera, I,
um, would like
to not see them if they're getting their sus license
suspended or, uh, I don't want to just to, uh,
reapprove them, you know, if they got to the point
where they got their license suspended, they need
to go someplace else and do their business.
Um, is is my opinion.
And, um, that's probably all.
Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Harris. That is the end
of audience.
Next item. Secretary Moore. Thank you.
The next item is, uh, nine a Stillwell Manner resolution.
I will read the, uh, resolution.
I believe there are some members here from Stillwell if
you'd like to come forward.
Ms. McGee, I believe you're the liaison to that. Mm-hmm.
Would you please present that to them? Okay, thank you.
Whereas Stillwell Manor located in the city of Warren,
Michigan was established in 1975
and has proudly served as a residence
and community for generations
of Warren residents for 50 years.
And whereas for half a Century, Stillwell manner has
provided safe, affordable,
and supportive housing for senior citizens,
fostering dignity, independence,
and a strong sense of community.
And whereas Stillwell Manner has been a place
where residents not only live
but thrive, building friendships, hosting activities,
and creating lasting memories
that strengthen the social fabric of our city.
And whereas the dedicated staff management
and volunteers of Stillwell manner have contributed
tirelessly to the wellbeing of its residents, ensuring
that quality housing
and compassionate care remain at the heart of its mission.
And whereas the Warren City Council recognizes the
importance of senior housing facilities such
as Stillwell manner in promoting stability, inclusivity,
and vitality within our community.
And whereas the 50th anniversary
of Stillwell Manner is a momentous occasion worthy
of recognition and celebration by the residents
and leadership of the city of Warren.
Now therefore, be it resolved
that the Warren City Council on behalf of the residents
of the city of Warren, hereby proudly commemorates the 50th
anniversary of Stillwell Manor
and extends its heartfelt congratulations
and gratitude to its residents, staff,
and supporters for 50 years of service
and commitment to our community.
Be it further resolved that this resolution be presented
to Stillwell manner
and honor of this historic milestone as a symbol
of the city's recognition, appreciation,
and best wishes for many more years of success
Resolution adopted this 14th day of October, 2025.
Um, if the members from Stillwell could come up
to the microphone and please introduce yourselves,
Jury burden, member of the Housing Commission.
Thomas Miller, member of the, uh, senior Housing Commission,
Debbie Laden Sack Housing
Commissioner.
Thank you. And I would make a motion to approve.
All in favor support property. Aye. Thank you. Aye. Aye.
Congratulations everyone. Thank you. Thank you
Madam President. I
would also like to thank the Council
for all you have cooked for us, for our Thanksgiving
and our Easter party,
and for all your fellowship attending our events
and hope that it continues into the
future. Thank you very much.
Thank you Mr. Bergman, very much.
No, no, this is, thank you. Thank you.
The next item is a, um, uh,
nine B Breast Cancer Awareness Month.
Um, I don't know if Monica was gonna be here,
she was gonna represent the residents for this one,
but, uh, we'll just do something with that.
Um, whereas breast cancer is the most commonly diagnosed
cancer among women in the United States,
impacting one in eight women over the course
of their lifetime, and also affects men.
And whereas early detection through regular screenings,
education and awareness significantly
increases survival rates and improves treatment outcomes.
And whereas advances in medical research, treatment
and community outreach have saved countless lives,
yet thousands of families continue to face the emotional
and financial burden of this disease each year.
And whereas the Warren City Council
recognizes the importance of raising awareness,
supporting those affected by breast cancer,
honoring their survivors,
and remembering those who have lost their lives.
And whereas Breast Cancer Awareness Month provides an
opportunity to educate residents, promote access
to screening and health resources,
and encourage community solidarity in the fight
against this disease.
And now therefore, be it resolved
that the Warren City Council does hereby proclaim the month
of October, 2025
as Breast Cancer Awareness Month in the city of Warren.
And be it further resolved that the Warren City Council
urges all residents to participate in community activities
that increase awareness, support, research,
and offer compassion to individuals
and families affected by breast cancer
resolution presented on this 14th day of October 25.
Motion to approve.
Um, Madam Chair, I would ask for a suspension of the rules
to let me make a statement.
Court make the motion to suspend the rules.
Thank you. Um, this resolution is especially
meaningful to me.
I sit here not only as a council member,
but also as a breast cancer survivor.
My cancer was detected extremely early, so early
that treatment was quick and my prognosis was excellent.
I'm grateful every day for early detection,
and I know that without it,
My story could have been very different.
I also want to acknowledge my colleague on this council
Councilwoman Roy, who shares a similar story
of breast cancer caught at its earliest stage.
Together, we are living proof of what early screening
and awareness can do.
That's why this resolution matters.
Breast Cancer Awareness month is more about wearing,
it's more than wearing pink.
It's about saving lives.
It's about encouraging our mothers, daughters, sisters,
and even our brothers to get screened
to know their risk and to take action.
I hope our residents hear our voices tonight
and remember that early detection makes all the difference.
And I hope our community continues to support research,
education, and those still in treatment to everyone fighting
to every survivor.
And in memory of those we've lost.
We honor you this month and every month.
Um, and now we would like everyone to
assemble in front of the stage,
and we are going to do a wear pink photo for TV Warren.
And just if we can get a vote on our resolution.
All in favor? Aye. Aye. Aye.
Thank you.
Everybody in the
all picture with
Oh, with, with.
Okay. Uh, look this way
or look this, you go over here.
We,
What are you thinking?
You're tall. Yeah.
So, okay.
Can we scoot in some,
if we can get more people down here in this
and have layers that might help.
Yeah. Tall people in the back, some folks
Over here.
Can you come this way please?
Tall people in the back, people in front.
Come as much this way as possible because the podium
come down this way, please.
We're trying to get past this. Come down this way. Yes.
Is this in the,
come down this way, please.
Squeeze in, come down this way.
We're trying to get past this podium here.
We'll take it out. Okay.
Okay.
Alright. Is everyone ready? Okay.
3, 2, 1. Okay, I gonna do another one.
3, 2, 1.
Okay.
3, 2, 1. One more.
3, 2, 1. Thank you so much. Thank.
Okay.
That's okay. I got,
okay.
Right. Three, two.
One, two
and one here.
3, 2, 1. Perfect. Thank
Audience participation.
Madam Chair. Mr. Lafferty,
I'd like to ask, uh, we've celebrated
your victory and Ms.
Moore's victory over cancer and kicking its butt.
But I'd like to ask for a moment of silence for all.
That's all. Those that we've lost, our loved ones, friends
and family that have, uh,
succumbed to this horrible disease.
These,
thank you.
I have, uh, one more item. Mm-hmm.
Um, let us pause to remember Sergeant Christopher
m ERs, who was tragically killed in the line
of duty 25 years ago.
Last week, on October 11th, 2000
Sergeant ERs made the ultimate sacrifice while serving the
people of Warren with courage, integrity, and honor.
His loss was felt not only by his family
and fellow officers, but by our entire community.
A community that remains forever indebted to him
for his bravery and service.
The passage of time has not diminished the impact of
that day or the depth of our gratitude.
Sergeant Wooters embodied what it means to wear the badge,
to protect and to serve.
Saturday afternoon, the Warren Police honor guard rendered a
21 gun salute in his memory,
reaffirming our city's enduring respect
for Sergeant Wooters, for his family,
and for all who continue to serve in his legacy.
May we never forget his name, his service,
or the sacrifice he made for the City of Warren.
Thank you. Thank you. Any other announcements?
Madam Chair, Mr. Lafferty?
Thank you. On Wednesday, September 24th, uh,
Councilman Dwyer, myself
and Ms. Moore attended the beautification dinner.
Where was the 31st Annual Residential Awards recognition
Out of 100 plus nominations submitted this year,
20 were chosen to be the class
of 2020 fives honorees.
And there were some wonderful stories shared
and beautiful, uh, photos
and gardens that were displayed, uh, at this banquet.
And so it's a wonderful example every year of
how people pour their heart and soul into their gardens.
And there's, uh, some importance
greater than just the beautification that they provide
because beauty
and the gardens that they represent
spreads in the neighborhood.
It becomes a competition neighborhood to neighbor.
And the beauty spreads.
And that's a wonderful thing to have in the neighborhood.
And it combats blight in every form.
Uh, one of the the funny stories that I came away with was
that one of the finalists that we were sitting at the table
with said that, uh, they had gone to the gazebo
for the dinner.
And well,
the dinner was held at the gazebo at 13 and Mound.
And this couple, and, uh, I won't, I won't say
where they live, uh,
but lived rather close by, went to the gazebo for the event,
the gazebo in the pocket park at Chicago
and Mound Roads Expecting, I guess a tent and tables
and, and dinner to be served right there at, at the corner.
So cute little story, something to remember.
But, uh, congratulations to all of the winners.
I'd also like to extend congratulations to, uh, center Line
Cono, Warren Mott,
and Sterling Heights High School for all earning
straight Division one ratings at the M-S-B-O-A festival held
this past Wednesday.
Uh, it was an incredible night of talent
and performance showcased by our high schoolers
and as a, uh, marching band dad
and a very proud, uh, uh, dad of a,
of a freshman marching band enthusiast.
Uh, it's, it's going
to be a wonderful four years in, in high school.
So I'm very much looking forward to seeing,
uh, this progress.
Warren Mot in fact, 23 years running
straight division one ratings.
So very, uh, very high honor.
And lastly, a, uh, very special moment for, uh,
our police chaplain Jay Michael Jackson,
who celebrated his 75th birthday over the weekend.
So happy birthday to Jay Michael Jackson
of the Warren Police Department.
Two more. Uh, yes.
And so we also have one of our very own,
our Warren firefighter Adam Maser Baker,
who was appointed
to fill a vacancy on the Warren Consolidated
School's Board of Education.
So congratulations to Adam Mazer Baker.
So wonderful, uh, individual family man,
and will make a great addition
to serving his community on top of serving his community
that he does every single day
as a firefighter serving our cities, our citizens.
So, thank you and congratulations to Adam Maser Baker.
Thank you, Ms. McGee.
Thank you. Um, what you may
or may not know, I am on the McComb St.
Clair Michigan Works board,
and they had decided along with myself to put on a youth
job training, um, for our youth
and teens on the 29th of this month.
Um, it will be held at fitzgeral, uh,
recreational Community Center, um,
on the 29th from three 30 to five 30.
So if you have some teams in your house
and, um, you want them to learn about how
to get a part-time job
or even apply for a summer job, please have them come out
for the event on the 29th
of this month on Wednesday from three 30 to five 30.
Thank you.
Any other announcements?
Hearing and seeing none. Next item.
Next item is 10 A, which is a public hearing
consideration and approval
of Brownfield Plan Amendment number four, pursuant
to public act 90 of 2023 village at the park.
85 25 Cole Street.
The petitioner is VIP, homes and Development.
Ms. Michaels, is there anyone here that can summarize this
or were you, are you being voluntold by me
to come summarize it?
Thank you, counsel.
Mary Michaels for the City Attorney's Office.
Just briefly, this is a Brownfield that
city council already approved back in, I believe,
2020 October of 2020.
It's for a development of 138 apartments.
The former owner is selling to VIP homes,
which created a new entity village at the park, LLC.
He's seeking an assignment of the brownfield
and an amendment to the brownfield.
Very minor changes mostly to infrastructure.
The detention pond, excuse me, will be in the middle.
And what he's agreeing to is to continue a 30% share
for the city, 10% administrative fee
and a 20% share of the tiff.
Um, this agreement was, well, the 20,
the 20% share was agreed to fairly recently.
And he's amended the brownfield,
which brings down the overall reimbursement from 8 million
plus to 7 million
eight hundred thirty four hundred and sixty three.
The original plan remains, its four buildings,
138 apartments.
And Mr. Castellana is here if the counsel
would like to hear from him.
Thank you. Any other questions, please let me know.
Thank you, counsel.
And the, the petitioner's here. Yes.
Um, would you like to speak? Okay.
Hello everyone. Uh, my name is, uh, Vito Castellana.
Um, I kind of dived into the, um,
project last time when we were coming in
for our district approval.
Um, the project is, is still the same.
It's 138 apartment units.
It's 46 1 bedrooms and 92 2 bedrooms.
Um, I'm excited
and my gut feeling is telling me that it'll be a success,
uh, because we own the project next door.
Um, uh, we are at 97% occupancy
and, uh, all of our rents, uh,
meet the workforce housing standard.
Um, our one bedrooms will go for around $1,300,
and our two bedrooms will go for around 17 to $1,800, uh,
which meets the Mista standards
for about 80% a MI on our entire project.
So, uh, we're excited to build, uh, new homes in Warren.
Um, we, we provide
provided a diagram last time
that shows the housing stock currently in Warren.
And we're proud to say that if, uh, if of course approval
of this project, it will be the first project in about 40
years of this size.
So I believe the demand is there.
Um, based on our studies, it showed that, um, a majority
of the people living in our communities are millennials
and that work within a five mile radius.
So I believe that the demand is there
and, um, we're looking to build this new community, uh,
beginning next year when we get
through our engineering approvals.
And, uh, we're very excited about it.
Um, previously we were asked about if a traffic
study was conducted.
It was, and I have a copy of it, um, if you like,
I could submit it for the record.
And previously I was asked about a parking ratio.
We do adequately park
276 spaces were required in which we have 285.
And what that dummies down to is each unit gets two spaces.
Um, so I have the traffic report I could give to you guys.
Um, it had little
or no impact on traffic due to there is four means
of ingress egress through, you could either get through
to our community through Longview, Lund, you could even go
through Tech Plaza if you like.
Uh, and, and get off on 12 Mile
or Van D**e pretty, pretty easily.
Um, a lot of people, if they're traveling north
or south, uh, on Van D**e can take Kennedy Circle, uh,
to our community through, uh, Kennedy Circle Drive.
Or if say you want to get off on 12 mile, you have two means
of ingress egress.
And that's what the, the report shows.
So I have that here as well.
Thank you. You can give the report to Ms.
Camp here on the end. Sure. Is anyone from No.
I'm gonna open the public hearing. Is anyone from the
audience like to speak on this matter?
Hearing and seeing none?
I will close the public hearing and entertain a motion.
Motion to approve
Support Lafferty with Discussion.
Discussion. Mr. Lafferty? The Mr. Boche,
Thank you.
Uh, I guess through the chair to Ms.
Michaels in absence of Mr. Bato.
Good evening, ma'am. Evening. I thought
so Just a follow up from the previous meeting
and the discussion regarding our, uh, the holdover
and the demolition costs.
Now, you made mention of it in the letter, uh,
on October seven, and you explained that the,
that Cole has assigned village
at the park rights to the payment.
Could you just expound upon that?
Yes. Um, Schaffer
or Cole Street Investments,
LLC did demolish the former Heartsick Junior High.
And they cleared it. He'd remediated it,
I believe there was some asbestos.
He did submit the cost, but never, he wasn't reimbursed
because nothing was built.
So there wasn't, there weren't any incremental
taxes to reimburse him.
Mm-hmm. Once they become available, they're,
those costs aren't being waived.
They are being assigned to VIP homes
or village at the park, LLC for reimbursement.
Okay. So Village at the park is taking on not only the,
uh, the cost, they're, they're buying the debt,
they're going to be reimbursed for it through,
through the new agreement?
That is correct. Absolutely.
And we're having Cole Street agree to that in the agreement.
Okay. That's, that is what I wanted to understand.
That is, I knew we had some, we had to have some liability
from the previous agreement
that we had authored back in, in 2020.
That was the loose end
that I wanted to make sure we
tied up. So thank you for clarify.
That is correct. He submitted this cost just in time.
Okay. Alright. Very good.
That, that is the only question I have. Thank you. Thank
You. Mr. Bokey.
Uh, I have a question for the petitioner.
If you could approach, please. Yes.
I might be a little premature in asking a question,
but, uh, what, what the project that's coming up,
was there con consideration for a retention pond
for water runoff from the apartments?
So previously when this project was approved years ago,
you didn't need a retention pond.
Now it is required. So we will retain water
and, um, getting engineering approval
because that's a new thing that, um, Eagle has,
has, has permitted.
So we will actually have a
functioning retention pond rather than previously approved.
It was a shallow pond
that didn't retain water. So that's a part, part
Of, so you take it into consideration.
I appreciate that. Mm-hmm.
Uh, so water doesn't end up in basements.
Correct. So thank you very much.
Yes. Yield back
Any, um, any additional questions?
Discussion?
Okay. Hearing, and let me see. Where am I at? So, Mr.
Lafferty, you made a support. Any other discussion?
Okay, I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty?
Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Newan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 10 B, which is a public hearing consideration
and approval of a commercial rehabilitation exemption
certificate pursuant to public Act two.
10 of 20 of 2005.
The petitioner is VIP, homes and Development.
8 5 2 5 Cole Drive, Warren, Michigan.
Anyone object to me.
Um, just opening the public hearing
and moving past the summary Petition, please.
Um, petitioner speaking. Okay. I'll open the public hearing.
Is anyone from the audience, uh,
interested in speaking on this matter?
Hearing And seeing none.
I'll close the public hearing and entertain a motion.
Motion to approve
Support Lafferty Discussion,
hearing, and scene, then I'll call the question.
Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr.
Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee? Yes.
Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 11.
A consideration and adoption
of a resolution approving an agreement between the city
of Warren and Turning point McComb.
So moved. Support Dwyer. Discussion,
Hearing And seeing none.
I will call the question. Ms. Moore. Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes.
Mr. Lafferty? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is? Yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item. Ms. 11 B, consideration
and adoption of a resolution, approving
and agreement between the city of Warren and St.
Vincent DePaul. Motion to approve
Support Lafferty.
Discussion, hearing, and scene? None.
I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee?
Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 11 C.
Consideration and adoption
of a resolution approving an agreement between the city
of Warren and Harts for homes so moved.
Support Lafferty.
Discussion, hearing, and scene? None.
I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Um, Mr. Nunan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 11 D.
Consideration and adoption
of a resolution approving an agreement between the city
of Warren and Care House.
So moved with discussion support Dwyer Madam Chair.
Discussion Ms. Warren, I just wanna see Ms.
Shanko, is there anything you wanna share with counsel
or are you good?
Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Any other discussion?
Madam President? Mr. Lafferty?
Ms. Moore, I, I wanted to make a note that all
of these letters were signed by Mr.
Bato and they indicate
that he's the community development director.
I'm not sure of that, if that's in the budget.
If he actually is the Community Development
director. So that, I don't know.
That shares the title under Economic Development
and Community Development Director,
which we do not have one at this time.
So I wanted to point that out for reference
and put that into the record.
Thank you. Thank you.
I will call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes.
Mr. Lafferty? Yes. Mr. Boye? Yes. Mr. Newan? Certainly.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 12. A legal update from Mr. Schroeder.
Motion to approve support. Discussion. Mr. Schroeder?
Thank you. A couple of things.
Um, in talking with the, um,
legislative affairs consultant within the last few days, um,
there's some bills pending in the legislature.
Um, one deals with the Creon, the gas station heroine,
um, that the council voted unanimously to have us look into
and see if we could ban that substance.
Um, we're running into some
potential preemption issues if we pass such an ordinance may
be preempted by state law,
but the legislature now has a plan to possibly,
uh, institute a statewide ban.
So that would be very helpful for us.
That bill dropped in mid-September. It's in the house.
It was referred to the Committee on regulatory
reform, so that's good.
In addition, there are some bills
that just dropped the other day that seem
to be moving very fast.
Um, I didn't see it coming,
but they're marijuana related bills and hemp related bills.
First with the marijuana, there's a proposal
in the state senate that's having a hearing tomorrow,
and this came up really fast,
that would put a cap on the number
of marijuana retailers in the city.
So even though now we have a zoning based limitation
that doesn't have a hard cap, the proposed legislation
would limit to five, um, one,
one marijuana retailer for every 5,000 residents.
Now, I heard from some people today that they may compromise
and make it one out of every 10,000 residents,
which in Warren would be a CAPA 13.
So this would come from the state.
Any existing facilities would be grandfathered in.
Again, apparently there's a hearing tomorrow in front
of a committee on this, this, this bill was just dropped.
So they're moving this for some reason.
Um, another part of the bill would be to
ban intoxicating hemp.
Intoxicating hemp is when they take hemp,
which is legal under federal law, unlike marijuana cannabis.
And they process it in such a way
that the THC levels are very high
and it could make you intoxicated high, whatever, as opposed
to the 0.3% or less THC where you don't get high.
And it has some other potential medical benefits.
So apparently gas stations and smoke shops
and other places are running, selling this gas station weed
that is really derived from hemp
and it's a loophole with the federal law.
So they're trying to ban that.
I think that would probably be good for the community.
Um, and they're doing some other things that would allow
legal hemp products that are under 0.3% THC
to be sold at retail anywhere.
So this just came up in the last couple days.
In fact, this afternoon I learned about it.
I thought it was important enough to mention now,
because you may want to call your legislator
and have further conversations
with your governmental affairs representative about
how this affects the city.
We may want to maybe have a community of the whole
to give direction on what to do here.
'cause this could have a big impact, um, on the city.
Uh, we've dealt with these issues in various different forms
and these issues are all kind of still out there.
So personally,
I think it would probably be helpful if I
understand the direction we were going.
But, um, that's an update.
We also have some other things on the agenda,
but that was the update I wanted council to get today.
Mm-hmm. Ms. Moore, I had a question about the,
um, the hemp.
What are the, what are the products that
incorporate that level of hemp?
That's a problem. Is it drinks or
Smoking? Yeah, so smoking
Or gummies or,
I, I'm not as up on it as I should be
because these are really products you can get at a gas
station and it will, you know,
it's hemp, it's drived from hemp.
So there's a whole federal law
that was passed several years ago that legalized hemp.
And so they've learned how to process it in such a way
that it becomes intoxicating.
The THC levels are much higher than what you would get,
you know, in a na in a natural form. So
It could be like, like a candy or a drink or anything.
Right. S smokeable products too. Oh,
Okay. Okay.
So, okay. There's all kinds
of intoxicating hemp products out there
and, um, there's sort of a loophole.
People are getting mail, ordering it
and everything, so, um, it's a problem.
Okay. Thank you. Any other discussion?
Motion to receive and file support?
Lafferty, I'll call the question. All in favor?
Aye. Aye. Any opposed? Thank you for the update, Mr.
Schroer. Next item.
Next item is 12 B request of City Treasurer Lori Barnwell
to authorize the hiring of outside legal counsel
for the treasurer's office consideration
and adoption of a resolution.
So move with discussion, support Lafferty.
Discussion, discussion, discussion Ms. Moore, then Mr.
Lafferty. And then Ms. McGee. Thank you.
I would like to ask Ms.
Barnwell to come up and please explain the situation.
I know it's very complicated
and it's gone on for a while, so maybe Yes. Lay terms.
Thank you. Thank you so much.
Um, counsel, um, I appreciate you, um,
hearing my thoughts, um, this evening.
I'm gonna read a few things I have written down
and of course, any questions that council has, um, of me
or my team, um, you can ask at that time as well.
Of course. Um, this evening I am asking City council
to approve outside legal counsel.
So I'm able to access the civil service agenda without the
mayor's direct approval.
Let me first acknowledge
that accessing the Civil Service Agendas, uh,
agenda still demands.
I work with a variety of qualified people.
I have to work with human resources on updated job
descriptions and ensure I'm following all policies
and procedures.
I have to work with union leaders
to ensure I am honoring their contracts
and putting members in a better position.
I have to work with the city council
and the controller's office
to ensure the budget is being followed.
Only after all these steps have been achieved,
may it proceed to civil service, like, um,
and in the past, having the mayor sign off
and approve everything going on, the civil service agenda
like they do for City council, was a way
of giving one less look for their, at their items to ensure
accuracy prop, proper execution of vision.
And that policy was being followed.
I served with the previous mayor for two terms,
and this ex is exactly what he did.
He ensured that his HR department unions
and the budget director were all fine with my items
and then sent them over.
Unfortunately, this is not the case with the current mayor.
This spring I presented to, to the city council a plan
for the future of the Treasurer's Office.
We had one significant retirement last year,
and in two years, there will be two more leaders retiring.
It is imperative that we keep the treasurer's office in the
hands of qualified employees who have been trained
to take the higher roles.
The city council approved my budget
and we got to work right away with human resources
and our union leaders to ensure we were all in agreement
and policy was being followed.
I cannot say enough about how great has been working
with our new HR director as well as our union leaders.
They offered great suggestions
and if something I said wasn't quite going to work,
they gave other other impertinent ideas.
Most importantly, and most recently, I worked with HR
and the Union on an upgraded job description approved
by City Council, HR Union, and then civil service.
This updated job description was basically taking
an already existing role in my office
and adding a couple more additional duties
that didn't exist before.
As the council and
and residents know, the investments
of our city have changed since I have become treasurer.
Our investments were only in simple savings or CDs in 2015.
Now we use state laws to maximize return.
When I started the return, um,
on our investments on a yearly basis was about 115,000.
In 2024,
the return on just our fund balance investments was over
$5 million for just one year.
Because our investments have not only expanded over the
years, there has been more time required on state
and city reporting, meeting with investors
and meeting with staff on best investment choices.
Also, requirements have changed over the years
and will keep changing at the state level.
This is why city council, HR
and the Union have all worked with us
and were in favor of this proceeding
to the civil service agenda where
that job description was approved.
When it came time to reclass the current employee to
that job, the mayor decided at the last minute
that this would not go on the civil service agenda
because she felt this job should go out for some reason,
to the rest of City Hall
and perhaps the public first of all.
And most importantly, that is not
what is listed in the council approved budget.
We do not have room for a new position.
This was simply an upgraded role that already existed.
This would not even be possible per policy
and procedure to place this job out.
I have tried to explain this to her numerous times as well
as others on my behalf.
It all seems so basic and easy to understand.
Departments expand, grow, and change.
You need to update job descriptions
and positions to keep up with the times.
Make no mistake, my budget that was submitted
to City Council and approved saves the taxpayer's money.
The mayor is suggesting we spend more money by putting out
for position that's not even in the budget.
I do not know if it is a lack of understanding need
for control or both.
I cannot have my department held back any further
because of the mayor's opinion and a very incorrect
and outside policy.
One at that. I have met
with the mayor several times this year,
including with my team.
I have provided charts
and pie graphs to help her understand my vision just
as I did with City Council,
though I felt it was unnecessary.
I have spent hours meeting with her
and her team on these simple issues
as a respectful courtesy.
And because of it and
because of the fact I make it my mission to try to work
with everyone on behalf of my team and the residents,
however, she has made it very clear she's
not going to change her mind.
Even though everyone else has been on the other side,
she's not following budget policy.
When the previous Mayor, mayor Falz was here,
we did not always get along personally,
but both of us gave each other the utmost respect.
Professionally. He would never try and hurt my employees
and hold up important progress in my office as long as laws
and policies are being followed.
Now, I am not able to get simple small promotions
that have been budgeted
and approved on the Civil service agenda for them
to approve or deny.
I believe this is also an overreach of power.
I am not an appointee of the mayor,
but a separately elected official.
We have a strong mayor form of government.
Does she feel she doesn't have enough power that she needs
to also control the Treasurer's Office?
For her to have such a direct role in hiring job
descriptions and promotions in the Treasurer's office
should give everyone pause.
We are the payment hub of the city with main access
to all the banking, investments and other financial duties.
It is not her role to oversee those things. But mine.
For many years, I have worked hard in my department
and stay in my lane, if you will.
I do not criticize others, but my role and, but,
but do my role and adhere to support her
or anyone else if asked, the mayor has a large lane,
and by city charter and law, she should stay in her lane
and not try to overreach and run another department.
She's not elected to be over. This is a matter of law.
One I feel is winnable based on past court cases
and our own charter, our own, our own, our charter
nor commission rules state
that the mayor's signature is required on these documents,
especially from a separate elected official.
Instead, the mayor should focus on doing her job, including,
including hiring a city attorney,
which should be a top priority.
There are a lot of issues right now here in Warren
that are not getting her attention.
She needs to refocus on those things.
Her residents are looking for her to make her own decisions
for the future of Warren, just like they are asking the same
of me work on the vision you are elected to Mayor,
do not overreach into others doing what they were elected
to do and approved to do by city council.
I'm asking the city council to allow me to bring my case,
uh, for this overreach of power.
I do not understand why it is harder for me
to access civil service agenda than the city council agenda.
I am able to send my items directly over to you.
If not the case, the mayor could hold up
and control opening new bank accounts, budget items,
contracts for needed financial services,
crippling my department already more than she already has.
Ultimately, these changes and updates we are looking to do,
do not impact me, but they are essential in helping my team
and our residents ensure the treasurer's office will
continue to run the financial arm of our city.
Effectively. The mayor has forced my hand in this matter.
If I'm not able to ensure my department is trained
and managed correctly,
the damage could be costly in many ways.
Most of my team is here tonight, and I am so proud of them.
I have seen them all grow in amazing ways.
They have all done their part
by doing wonderful work for our residents.
Now it is my job to ensure they have the training
and support to go to the next level.
So when the next treasurer comes in,
they will come in like I did with a wonderful team in place,
ready to help walk beside them as we they transition
and enter a new chapter.
I just wanted to note too,
before, uh, I came here this evening, I, I did receive, um,
um, an email from the mayor
and, um, she was
discussing civil service policy
and all these things that had nothing to do with, um,
what I'm talking about here tonight.
I just wanna say, mayor, I am aware of civil service policy.
I've been following it for 10 years.
And this is an overreach of power.
And this is about the mayor should not be in control over,
um, another elected official.
And though she's, you know, the mayor is a nice person,
but so far in my eyes, has proven to not be
a decisive leader
and not able to make hard decisions.
The only thing that I have seen her do is stand in the way
of other leaders trying to make those, those
decisive choices.
Whether it comes to things with my office,
she's stood in the way the, the South End Library
where residents have waited for years
and years for these services.
She tried to stand in the way
and claim we don't have the funds even though we have
$8 million, um, just waiting
for these residents to get these services.
She tried to stand in the way of the Land Bank Authority,
which is going to be used so effectively to to,
to build more homes
and get more residents, um, to be homeowners.
So if mayor, you want to, you want
to run your administration how you want to, that's fine,
but I would ask that you stay out of the way of leaders
who are trying to be decisive
and make a difference for the residents.
Thank you, Ms. Barnwell.
Um, I, I do wanna state that, um,
during our budget hearings, um, Ms.
Barnwell, um, presented very comprehensive plan
for the future and certainly commend that because, um, Ms.
Barnwells not going to be in this job, uh,
almost two years from now.
And she had the foresight to set her department up
for success, keeping in mind those things
that were gonna happen, retirements and other things.
I wish everybody in this city had the foresight
and, um, really the, the charity of doing that,
because you don't have to do that,
but you are setting things in motion so
that Warren is better after you leave and it will be a void.
You won't be in the treasurer's office.
You've been the best treasurer
we've ever had, in my opinion.
Um, now what is holding it up? Is it a signature?
Yes. So basically what the, what the process is,
is as we wanna do things, you know, so we have to go
before your body first
and get city council approval on any new updated job.
You know, just kind of like
what I did when I came before you.
Here's what we're looking to do.
Then we work with HR on these job, um,
descriptions, making sure they're in line
with other job descriptions
and it's, you know, following union contract
and, you know, all of these things
that HR makes sure that we do.
So, you know, there were, for example,
there were titles in the city council budget
that HR was like, well, we can't really use that title
because of these reasons.
So we changed, um, the title.
So those, and those things seem small,
but they are important.
They are following policy.
So, um, you know, we work with HR
and then I have always had a great relationship
with our unions as well.
And ensuring
that the unions are on the same page is very important
because if you don't do that first
before it goes to civil service, then you know,
there there could be miscommunication
and unions could say, well Lori, this is going
to perhaps hurt x, Y, z um, employees.
So that's why you always get the support, um,
and cooperation of the unions before you proceed.
And that's what I've done my entire career.
Um, every time we do, um, a reclassification
or we do a promotion
or there's any changes, we're always constantly running
that by the union.
So, you know, like we're there, there was a lot of meetings,
you know, we did a lot of things.
And then the final step, um, so then,
so everything is then submitted through human resources
and then the mayor signs off
before it goes on the agenda, the civil service agenda.
Okay. So we got everyone, um, on agreement, everyone's good.
And then by the time it gets to the mayor for her
to do her last sign off, she has a problem with it,
even though all this other work has already been done.
And, and then I, it's like, you know, it's one thing for her
to have a different opinion,
but what she's asking is actually against the budget. So,
So, so I think, um, Mr. Schroeder, you're uh, well aware
of, I think there was a similar, uh, lawsuit
that was brought in the county dealing with, um,
the county executive
and a duly elected official in, um, the county.
Um, that is similar.
Um, I am just wondering, um,
does the mayor have the authority?
Is it an approval authority
or does a ministerial sign the paper authority?
And I don't know if it's appropriate,
but since council approved the budget
and your positions you've worked with, uh, the unions
and mentioned that when we did our discussions,
if we've approved that there is a provision in the charter
that the mayor is supposed to sign
anything council says ask her to sign or tells her to sign.
So I'm not sure where, where that falls under
what we can mandate if it's already,
we've approved it in the budget.
Right. And it's gone through, it's gone
through all the other approvals.
Right. Um, it seems to me we're gonna have
to have some clarification on what you can do.
You are duly elected.
You answer to the people, you do not answer
to the mayor in certain circumstances.
You do answer to city council when it comes to your budget.
Absolutely. Right. And things and
or what you wanna change banks
or there is, is a sort of a, a, a double check, right?
Absolutely. But you know, you don't report
to us your day-to-day activities,
nor do you report to the mayor for that.
So I think that there is, obviously,
if the mayor is not gonna, um, fulfill
her obligation in my opinion, then certainly, um,
you are within your rights to, uh, bring on legal counsel
to settle this matter.
I have to say, I'm very impressed that you have a copy
of this, the rules and regulations
of the Civil Service Commission.
'cause I think I asked for that for three years
and, uh, never got a copy.
We might have a copy now.
You might have seen one Mr. Schroeder. Nope. Yep. Huh?
Send it over. I still wait.
Yeah, we've never seen the, uh, civil,
we've asked three years, uh,
for the rules from the Civil Service Commission,
and we have been denied having them.
Um, and I have a question for you.
Do you have access to the city's intranet?
The, um, internal website? Yeah. Yeah.
I mean, you could get on there
and find out what the city policies are like
for travel or other things like that.
Interesting, interesting.
Um, I will say if, um, you know, anyone is welcome
to look at because that's why, um, I sent them over.
There is nothing in that handbook that I have read
that the mayor has to sign off on, you know,
had the final like sign off authority
before it goes to the Civil Service Commission.
Then why doesn't just, why, why can't you just send it
to civil service and,
um, have it heard there?
I think that what Is stopping, what is,
is there something stopping that from happening?
I think that, you know, not, I think
that her administration, um, is going
to be hesitant to do just se send it over without her
approval, which, which I understand there it is kind of,
they're in a tough middle spot.
So I think that like, you know, that is the, that is
what HR does is they have her,
but it's like, my, my argument is
this is past precedence more than it's actually policy.
So, and without any kind of legal
remedy, I don't know how to, I don't know how
to access the civil service agenda.
That seems like a serious flaw
or problem with the Civil Service Commission that, um, you
as an elected official and,
and a, an autonomous really department head
that you don't have direct access.
You have to go through somebody else,
just like the clerk should be able
To do that, right?
Absolutely. And I mean, it wasn't really an issue
for me under the previous mayor.
Um, sometimes you would call
and ask simple questions, basically it would be ensuring
that policy was followed.
That's more how he used it.
Um, he didn't really get into the weeds of like,
I didn't have to explain every single, um, facet of it,
but it was very much like this went through the property,
you know, and there was like a checklist he would go through
with me from time to time if he, you know, wanted
to have concern on, on an item.
But there was never, which was, I was happy, I was happy
to do because I always filed policy.
So there was no, I i there, there was no question
or worry then.
But now I am following policy.
I'm going through out of my way to go through all
of the correct channels
and it's still being denied on the agenda.
And just very simple little things that are, that are
Silly. This is silly.
It's very silly. This is very silly.
And it's, it's honestly been a huge
strain for my department.
Yeah. And I think that's that, you know, if this is just,
you know, a political thing, like you're trying to,
you know, hurt me politically or personally
or whatever the situation is, like that's not,
that's not what's happening here.
You're hurting my department, right?
You're hurting my people.
We should be supporting each other a hundred percent
to make the city is, is, yeah.
And I hate to miss this, but,
and Mary Camp will attest to this, our relationship,
whether, whatever it was personally with former Mayor Fout,
our offices worked really, really well together.
We never had problems between the offices
and we didn't have any of those kind of problems.
But, um, so you finished Jonathan? Yeah. Yeah.
So I'm, I'm totally in favor.
Um, you do what you need to do. Thank you, Mr. Lty.
Thank you, Mr. Lty. And
Ms. Moore, you touched on one of the questions I was going
to ask about, is this a the
and more focused on the approvals?
Is it statutory or is it ministerial?
And, and then you said the two words that I really wanted
to focus on past precedents,
and it's a clear misunderstanding, most likely of what
that signing is really indicative of.
Yeah. So, and,
and this really is, despite this late evening word salad
that was sent to all council members, I,
I don't even know what it says.
It, it cites a few terms,
but it doesn't really make an argument.
You made a very compelling argument this evening.
If this is a counter, perhaps it is, I don't know.
I'm, I'm not quite sure what it is.
But it didn't make a case for why she stands on,
on her authority or is trying to stand on her authority.
So this is the land bank all over again. Yep.
This really is, and and you called it out before,
but what we did with the, the Land Bank,
and I'm in favor of granted you the, the ability
to hire legal counsel, but I want to avoid litigation.
And we did so with the Land Bank.
I would like to know if we can have the city attorney, Ms.
Michael's office, who is not an appointee of the mayor,
so she has no fear
of reprisal from the administration in this case,
and could author an opinion
on what the authority is on the letters sent
to the Civil Service Commission if she has legal standing
to prevent an autonomous elected official from,
uh, direct access to the, the Civil Service Commission,
as you so eloquently stated.
And if she does not, then she has until the, the date
of the next civil service meeting to comply.
If she doesn't, your office has the authority to
engage legal counsel
and seek relief in the Macomb County Circuit Court.
I think it puts that. Is that a new motion you're making?
Well, I'm, I'm making some considerations. Okay.
I am, like I said, I don't want to go straight to court.
I think that we have sufficient
information to make a decision.
Like I said, I'm very much in favor,
but I would like to have the City Attorney's office issue
that letter to clarify that she has standing
or she does not have standing.
And then, you know, based on this,
I've not been able to find anything.
Mr. Schroeder, if there's anything in the, in the charter
that says these must go through, uh, the mayor for
approval and is that a statutory approval
or a ministerial approval?
And if that's not the case,
the city attorney can clarify it.
She can tell her she has zero legal standing
and she has to send it forward if she fails to, Ms.
Barnwell has the appropriate legal recourse.
I I think that's a prudent course of action in this case.
I will move on to some other audience
and circle back to you if you want to make
or not audience, sorry,
other, um, discuss that's, that's fine.
Discussion. And then if you wanna make a new motion, we can,
um, Ms. McGee and then Mr. Bokey.
Yes, Mr. I appreciate it. Um, Ms.
Barnwell, um, all that you have done
for the Treasury Department, I also appreciate that.
My question is because you had not, well,
the first concern I have is who's
gonna pay for that attorney?
And it looks as though the city is
going to pay for that attorney.
And I believe you've given us a price, uh, a rate
of 2 75 per hour for that attorney.
And I don't wanna pay for attorney in order to
get some information or make the
mayor do what she need to do.
I wanna be able to work it out first.
And don't get me wrong, I believe you have tried,
and I understand your position as an elected official,
that you can move forward.
Um, my question is, I didn't hear what civil service
and I didn't get a chance to read it all,
what the civil service requirements are.
Now, me knowing hr, like I I do, usually they require you
to post something before you say you're going to promote.
I mean, promote a person or move them to another level.
Does the Civil Service Commission
or requires you to post this position?
And if it's a requirement for you to post it first
through the city, whether you are elected
or not, we have to do so.
So have you, have you decided post it?
If so, um, what was the outcome?
Thank you. Um, that is not a requirement of civil,
civil service, nor is it a requirement of our unions.
So this basically what we've done, um, we had, um,
a position in the budget.
It was accountant three.
So in the budget that you approved, this body approved,
um, and that was passed.
We took that position out,
even though the person was still in that position
and put it at the upgraded level.
The reason, as I explained in here is
because we were adding this need that we had to, for, um,
investment reporting, which has grown and grown
and grown into, you know, a, a part of our office
that wasn't there before.
So basically that upgraded position is what's in the budget.
So there's no body there, there.
If I put out, if you put out
for a role, there has to be an opening.
There's no opening.
So it's a simple reclass into this promoted role.
So there's nothing to put out to another.
Um, and, and I mean, I just wanna say that no,
no one else will really qualify
because it's a top union role in my office.
So it requires you working the treasurer's office
for like, many, many years.
So this is not something that anybody could really get
outside of this person.
This is a, this is a policy and, and this is a law issue.
The council passed a budget. Mm-hmm.
We as a treasurer's office are trying to follow that budget.
The mayor is not, um, very simply is not following the,
the budget and this, um, position.
It has a salary, I believe, of like $110,000.
So she is saying that we should put this
position out somehow, even though we don't have the money in
the budget and spend another over a hundred thousand dollars
of money that is not in the budget.
So you asked about outside attorney,
and, you know, the cost of that.
We are hoping to resolve this very quickly
because I feel very, um, you know,
after speaking with many, you know,
people on the legal side, that we have a strong argument
that she doesn't have the authority to block
a separate elected official from accessing, um, this agenda.
Just as she doesn't have the authority
to block anything I bring to you.
So this position does not require you to post it.
'cause I'm thinking if they're not qualified for you to,
to be, if you don't have a qualified person,
or you have the highest qualified person,
then if it was posted,
it probably would've been filled by now. Am I correct?
Do what? No. So basically this is all we did was take, um,
a position that already exists, work with HR
and add it a couple things to that role.
And it's like an upgraded, um, position.
So instead it is, you know, instead of making 99,000,
they're making 110,000
because they're doing more, um, investment reporting,
meeting with banks with me,
and making, helping make these, um, investment decisions.
So it is an upgrade
and update to an already existing position.
So it, it is not an open, um, position that, that would need
to go out or has the money to go out.
And this is like, but even if
It's an upgrade, isn't that a a form of promotion?
If, if it's an upgrade,
even if it's a couple level rela reclassify,
if it's a upgrade, does it require you
to post it because it's a
Upgrade? It it does not.
It doesn't.
That is not a, a civil service, um, rules and procedures,
nor is it union rules and procedures.
It's not. Okay. No.
And that is why, like I said, that is why
that is like the disconnect right now between the mayor
and I is she has this, I I I, I can't even speak for her
because I, I don't really know where she's getting any
of this information, but
that is why the department head is charged
by in the civil service rules, um, and procedures.
They are charged to work with hr.
They have to, I have to and, and, um,
and I'd want to anyway, but, um, HR ensures
that I'm following HR policy.
The union ensures that I'm following union contract.
Once it gets to civil service, they could make, um,
the decision to approve, um,
or deny, um, our civil service, um, agenda,
or I'm sorry, our civil service c um, commission.
Um, all of them are great, um, members,
and they think very critically, um, on these things.
And they, it's up to them at this point
to offer an approval or denial.
The mayor should not be offering a approval
or denial. And if
They deny, can they like, use a grievance process
and move forward and said,
we deny we don't want this person in this position.
You have to post it first.
Um, I don't, I don't think they would do that
because it's not in the budget.
So this whole, the that,
and that's basically what I'm saying.
The, um, the Civil Service Commission, most
of them have been involved and worked in this,
or have worked in the city.
If this is not in the budget, they will not per, they,
they will not go, um, against the council budget.
So it's like this idea of posting it,
it is not an open position.
It is, there is not the room in the budget.
Okay. My, my next question is for Mary Michaels,
if you could come to the mic.
I appreciate it. Thank you.
So my question to you is, um,
when I called today, I tried to get some questions answered
regarding this because I couldn't understand why we need a
separate attorney and why I was required
to have an attorney on this situation in this matter.
Why can't we work this out?
Um, would've been worked out if we just would've
just posted it.
I can't answer that right now. I don't know.
I have the background.
You don't have the background.
I don't have the background information.
Have the mayor spoke to you regarding the position?
No. Okay. Okay.
This cannot be lawfully posted.
I would be going against your authority. Okay.
Um, um, Madam Vice, sorry. Vice president.
I'd be going against you. Okay, Ms. Michael, do you
Have anything in addition? I'm done.
I'm done. Thank you. I may, Ms
Yes.
I'll talk to the mayor about this.
I know it's in the ordinance that the mayor can, will,
can approve, um, request for vacancies
that's in the by ordinance.
But what limits there are on the exercise of discretion,
that's, that has to be reviewed legally, which I'll do.
But what I'd like to do is a chance
to work this out between Ms. Barnwell
And the mayor. I would like that. Yeah.
Thank you, Ms. Michaels. Thank you.
Um, anything further, Ms. McGee? No.
Okay. If you were, I do do have
one more question for you, Ms.
Barnwell, if you were to not receive approval from us,
could you proceed
and still get a lawyer to take care
of it without us, our approval?
No. No. Okay.
Just, I wanna make sure. Okay. Thank you. I appreciate
It. Mr. Bokey.
Ms. Barnwell, I would wanna commend you.
I, I did, I did it at the budget meeting.
You were, you were the only one there
that was very well prepared.
Uh, you answered all our questions.
Uh, when we talked about the library funds,
uh, you answered them.
Uh, those numbers were backed up by our city controller.
And I see the problem you have, uh, as far as posting
or not posting, you know, to me it's irrelevant right now
because that's a union issue.
And if it's a union issue, they'll file a grievance.
And that could always be handled
through a grievance process.
Um, but this is isn't a new opening.
This is, uh, combining a position and upgrading.
We do that in a budget all the time.
We did it for the police department. Mm-hmm.
For, uh, an employee there to
recognize their cer uh, certification.
We do it all the time. So I don't know what the problem is.
Now, I could tell you again, is anybody here
for an administration to, to rebut any of this
and, uh, advise us?
You know, uh, I don't see
From hr.
I'd like to hear the, uh, thank you.
Hello, everyone. Um, yes. Uh, as Ms.
Barnwell has stated, I've worked really closely with her
to try to get her positions through.
Uh, this included a lot of conversation with not just me,
but my staff, the unions, the mayor.
Um, I guess to summarize all this, the biggest question
for the position she's looking at,
which is treasurer manager, is whether it should be posted
or reclassified.
Um, and so it goes either way.
If it's posted, it follows the Civil Service Merit System.
Um, it would go for about a week.
Um, and then it would go
to whoever the top qualified candidate would be.
Um, if it's Reclassed,
it would go into whoever the most top
qualified candidate is.
Um, that's only if we know for a hundred percent fact
that there's no one, um, that would get this position
besides the person who's being offered the role.
Um, but besides that, you know, I've spoken to Ms.
Barnwell and Mayor Stone,
and they're both kind of once posted once Reclassed.
Um, but that's kind of the summary
of everything that we're at.
Thank you. Question, since you're in charge
of the human resources, uh, I was under the impression
that Civil Service has an outside attorney.
They use from time to time. Uh,
We use our legal department.
All of our legal department attorneys have to sit on
a couple, I think it's like two commissions.
Since you've been here, we've been using local co.
Our City attorney. In other words, no. Outside counsel.
No. I use, uh, Laura Sullivan. She's our legal department.
Um, alright, so where we at?
You're recommending it or not recommending it?
Well, in this instance, the, the way that it was explained
to me back in June was that the mayor has per charter,
or ordinance, whatever it may be, has final authority over
how her administration is run.
Right. Efficiently, whatever it may be.
And then I was explained by the legal department, um,
you know, the mayor has the authority to pause
or ask questions on things going towards
the civil service board.
Am I a lawyer? Am I an attorney? I can't explain that.
I think this would be a conversation as recommended between,
um, the attorneys and legal to kind of go to that way.
Um, but I'm operating how the way it was explained to me.
Okay. Yeah. When you say the, the mayor has authorization,
that's over appointees.
How about an elected official?
That one I can't answer for you.
You know, because the electric official is governed by
what we approving the budget.
Mm-hmm. You're right.
That's a legal question.
Non-lawyer. That is a good question.
Thank you. Oh, you Beck. Thank you, Mr. Newnan.
Yeah. So, um, like yourself, I'm, um,
I'm not a lawyer and I'm just reading through,
um, the rules
and regulations of the Civil Service Commission,
which were nicely, uh, added to our packet.
And I hadn't, I hadn't seen that before.
But, uh, I, like, I'm in favor of Councilman Lafferty's idea
of, uh, I'd rather have it settle it
in system rather than start bringing in extra resources from
out of the system and maybe have it snowball.
I, I'm hoping that, um, Ms.
Michaels will be able to come to a determination that both,
uh, treasurer Barnwell
and Mayor Stone will be able to agree on.
I, it may not, if that it doesn't happen, I'm more in favor
of letting Ms.
Barnwell have a lawyer to, um, you know, to,
to go through and hopefully come up
with an independent opinion
and get that ruled on by a court if necessary.
I, I, I have a hunch that Ms.
Barnwell is, is correct,
and that the mere should, should yield on this.
Um, and I'm, I'm reading in the, um,
the rules and regulations of the Civil Service Commission,
like I said, uh, for the benefit of the,
at least the council, I'm on page 1 0 3 5
1035 of the packet.
And item 2.2 says, upon the creation of department heads
and special personnel positions,
and I think this sounds like a special personnel position,
the personnel director shall request
and receive from the mayor and council a determination
regarding, regarding civil service status
of the position prior to the appointment
and appointment being made.
I don't know whether that is relevant here or not,
but it sounds like, uh,
it sounds like it's in the Civil Service Commission to, uh,
to come to work things out internally.
But, um, anyways, that's where I'm at right now.
I'm, I'm in favor of making a motion such
as Jonathan Lafferty was, uh, coming up with,
Um, um, um, Madam Chair, if I can just,
Mrs. Barn, Ms. Barnwell, I,
I, I would ask you
to please speak if you a comment.
Oh, thank you. Thank you.
Um, I just wanted to know the chair that this particular,
I think, you know, is, um, our, um, um,
HR director summed up really well like this, um,
a particular situation, which is posted or reclassed,
but the reason why we can't post is
because it's not in the budget.
So the posted like realm is that they wanna, I,
and I really don't know why they're pushing
so hard for it to be posted.
Um, the reason we can't do posted,
because then we are not following the budget.
So her opinion on
how things should be done is actually unlawful, number one.
Number two, um, I, I, I, I am a huge
advocate for working things out internally,
and I have, I, I try to work with everyone,
including this mayor.
And as, um, Rocky
as maybe the last mayor.
Um, and I were at times, it never got to this,
so I'm tell I'm telling you, I've been trying for a year
to sit down with her, to work things out to, you know, um,
even, um, a member of the civil service, um, commission,
to my understanding, ask the attorney, um,
I think a few meetings ago, can a separate, um,
elected official, um, just put some have, um, can access,
you know, us if they follow all the policy
and they never heard back yet.
So I think that we have tried through all of these channels
to sit down and work things out.
And I'm coming before you
because this is my la this is the last resort I've had.
Like I said, I've had so many meetings with Mayor Stone.
Many, um, my department has been with me for some
of these meetings, pleading their case, pleading
for the future of our department.
And, um, this is not just, I mean,
this is their livelihoods.
This is their future. This is what we're trying to create
for the residents, for the next treasurer coming in.
If we can't train, things are going
to suffer in the department.
We send wire transfers for millions of dollars.
We collect thousands of dollars,
and we are overseeing millions
and millions of dollars, um, of investments.
And I know residents do wanna make sure
that state's incompetent qualified hands.
This is not a game. This is, this is serious business.
And if, if I did not think it was serious,
I would not be here tonight.
Thank, thank you so much for coming.
And I, I hear your frustration.
You, I'm pretty sure the council is gonna work with you
to get this resolved.
Thank you. Um, I yield,
Thank you, Gerald.
Thank you for stepping up,
Madam Chair.
Mr. Lafferty, and then go
Ahead. No, I'll, I'll
yield to Ms. Moore.
So first off, we're here
because nothing has been able to be worked out.
And I think it's just, it's a, uh, not a good idea
to involve Ms.
Michaels being a referee between two elected officials.
That just is not a good position to put Ms. Michaels in.
Um, she actually, if, if she was,
if she was the city attorney, she would report directly
to counsel, and we would give her direction tonight
to make sure you get what you need.
That would be what we would tell her.
She would go to the mayor and say, this is
what counsel wants, get in line.
Right. But she's not in that position. Right.
So there's really, I don't see any other way.
And we're certainly not gonna involve the civil, you know,
the other people in the legal office to be put between
two elected officials.
I think that is an just a horrible situation to put any
of them in, because their job is to provide legal advice
to all the departments.
And the fact is, only city council can hire attorneys
outside of the city only.
That's vest totally with us. Nobody else can do that.
They've done it in the past,
but that is against the charter and against the rules.
But that's another thing. I don't see another way.
Um, I think that we have to bring in legal counsel.
This has been, this has been since April or May
or June, when June, um, this has been going on.
I've been, I've had ongoing discussions with Ms.
Barnwell for months and months and months
and have tried everything.
The unions have approached me.
The unions want this to happen.
The unions are very frustrated that the mayor is
becoming involved in this minutiae in offices
that she shouldn't be involved in,
or, I don't know, she shouldn't be.
But I think there's so much going on in this city
that could be taken care of.
And we're worried about three additional duties being given
to one person in a tiny raise in a budget
of $400 million plus.
It's, it's, it's really ludicrous to think that this is
where, uh, the attention of the mayor
of the third largest city in Michigan
is focusing her attention.
I don't know if it's to give you a hard time.
Maybe you threaten her. I don't know.
Uh, I don't know what what it, what it is.
But I think we need to move forward.
You've wasted enough time.
Your employees have been sitting pa waiting patiently
for this nonsense to be over with.
Not your ideas, but having to deal
with this is absolutely nonsense.
And I would certainly, you know, maybe there's a mediation.
Maybe we get a mediation panel.
I don't know how that would be put together.
Maybe Mr. Schroeder has an idea how to settle this.
I don't know. Do you, would you like to weigh in?
The only thing I have to say is I've been
listening very cl carefully.
I think that there's two issues here.
There's the access to the Civil Service Commission,
whether you have access,
then there's the merits of the requests.
Those are two separate things.
And I think we're here, we're talking about
access to a commission.
In 1956, the charter was adopted by the voters
creating this civil service system.
And the charter's very clear that it says
that the city shall establish
by ordinance a civil service plan.
And why do we have civil service? It's a merit based system.
It's two, and this is actually very progressive
for 1956 in warrant i i was reading this one.
Wow. It says they shall provide a professional
and impartial approach
to municipal personnel problems based solely on the fitness
training and experience of employees
and expectant employees of the city
with no discrimination on the account of racial, political,
or religious backgrounds or opinions.
That's 1956.
And then subsequently, a civil service ordinance was passed.
So the ultimate question here is,
can this independently elected official access this
commission whose job it is to make these decisions?
And I think it's wrong to, maybe she's right,
maybe she's wrong, but to give her access
to get a decision, yes or no.
Maybe it's no. And if it's no, then you're gonna have
to figure out what your next step is.
That's what I see here. Yeah.
I can't see the, uh, planning commission,
having the mayor say, Nope, your request for a rezoning.
Nope. I'm gonna say you don't have access to planning.
'cause I don't like it. Nope.
You can't go to the zoning board
and request your, uh, variance for zoning
because we don't like it.
We think it's not gonna pass no taxpayer.
You can't go to the board of review
and appeal your tax assessment
because we ultimately think it's a bad idea.
These boards and commissions are there to, to, to function
and make these decisions.
So I think it's just a bad idea
to mix the two and into one question.
The question is access
to this commission and why it's there.
We have an independently elected official,
we have a board that's appointed.
I mean, it is really stunning that we spend
so much time on something about access to a commission
by an elected official.
So maybe, maybe a request gets denied. Maybe it's approved.
But I think a mediation, I think you give the mayor,
like we did with the Land Bank, 10
or 14 days, uh, mediation.
I'm willing to go with Ms. Michaels and sit
and talk to anybody to just get
through this basic question, to get this done.
These lawsuits mm-hmm. Cost tens of thousands of dollars.
But it, but there,
but at some point, you, you can't let
you know one issue, uh, go, because I, you know, Ms.
Barnwell is trying to run her department.
So my suggestion is to try to mediate it
and save the taxpayers money outta court.
But, you know, obviously, um, I think the next, uh,
civil Service commission meeting is November 12th.
So we got some time to maybe work out a mediation.
And if it can't work by then in court,
and I also will mention, since you asked me to weigh in,
and I'm more than happy to, um, we are considering, um,
and we've, we've mentioned this two
or three times, amendments
to the civil service ordinance itself.
And I think those amendments will
ultimately solve this problem.
Okay. And modernize, we're, we're still working on that.
Uh, again, it is taking a little longer than I hoped,
but we want to get it right.
So that's another potential fix. Ms.
Barnwell does not wanna wait, you know, for two readings
of an ordinance, a potential veto and all that time.
But, um, I think if the next civil service meeting is
November 12th, there should be request the mayor,
you can't order the mayor, request the mayor
to attend a mediation to get over the hump
of just letting it go on the agenda.
And then the mayor can show up.
She can, she can show up at the Civil Service
Commission with Ms.
Barnwell, and they can each make
their case and see what happens.
But at least we get past that initial decision of access.
So why don't we put a two week from
until our next meeting,
and if there's no resolution of the issue in two weeks,
we revisit the, um, hiring, uh, outside counsel.
If I, I, I, I don't know who,
so who, I suppose if you could go to the, the chairperson
of the civil service and go directly
and just file whatever you want with them, I don't know
what would stop you from doing that.
I think it's because, um, human resources, um,
creates the, um, agenda.
So there, there have been other department heads under the
mayor's administration who have dealt
with things similar to me.
So I am not, um, a lone wolf over here.
But unfortunately they are not separately, um, elected.
But they have gone to the civil service agenda
and frustration of also not having access for reasons
that they don't think are per policy and their departments.
I won't, you know, go into which ones.
But there have been other departments
that have suffered greatly for similar concerns
to mine. And, um,
I've heard, I've had meetings
with unions discussing the frustration
and problems they're having, um, in the last Right.
Six months particularly.
And I do agree with, um, Mr. Schroeder, I did want
to bring this, um, particular example so that way you, you
as a body would understand the
frustration that I'm dealing with.
But I agree with, um, Mr. Schroeder,
the bottom line issue is not this particular reclass.
It's really the ability for me
to access civil service, um, agenda.
And then they could make the decision to approve
or deny just as this body approves, um,
or denies anything i, I present in front of you.
So that's the greater question.
And there's gonna be other, other things
that we're working on with HR and with unions.
And I can't, like, this one, to me,
it was just like such an easy, like it's in the budget,
it's just a, you know, whatever.
I mean, there are other ones that are going
to be a little more challenging that the unions and, um, HR
and I have to work out, which that's totally great and fine.
But I, I can't keep running into this extra roadblock every
time I want to access civil service.
I mean, I'm, we're unfortunately not gonna get everything
done that we, I need to get done before I leave as
Treasurer would, would two weeks Yeah.
Work for you? Yes, we can.
We got another prob we got a similar problem
over in the fire department.
They're not civil service,
but, you know, we're still two years we've been dealing
with, uh, it's, it's just awful a position over in fire
that's in administration.
It just, just makes absolutely no sense.
So if we could try to work out something in two weeks,
Mr. Schroeder, you're amenable to meet meeting and,
and, uh, whoever you wanna bring and, uh, and be involved.
Yeah. And do it that way.
So that would be my motion, amend my motion
to bring it back in, uh, two weeks to counsel.
Do what you can in the interim.
And at that point we'll revisit the idea of hiring
outside legal counsel to, um, um, figure out
what we can do from there.
Excellent. Mr. Chair, uh, through the chair
to Ms. Moore, I was going to amend simply
to add the condition of the,
the letter from Ms. Michael said, I'm more than amenable
to the, the mediation,
but to have that already approved, I'm more than in favor
of approving legal counsel, giving her the ability
to hire today and leaving that, leaving that here.
If mediation works, if the mayor sees
that we're a unified front and,
and she has no choice in the matter, then
the legal counsel does not need to be hired,
Then we don't have to deal with it again. And
We don't have to. But
I, I was
Going to say that. Fine. That's,
I, that would work for me.
I have no problem with that whatsoever.
I, I was very good with the, the date for compliance
to be the 28th.
That's two weeks, but the deadline to submit
is the 5th of November for her
to submit her reclassification,
Reclassification. So that would all
fit in at that point.
And then the next deadline would be the 12th
for the meeting of the 3rd of December.
So through the chair to Mr. Schroeder, would we,
would she be seeking injunctive relief in circuit courts?
I think it would be more of what would be called
a rid of mandamus.
Okay. Yeah.
Timeline time-wise for turnaround once it's filed?
Uh, well, it depends on
how much the court would consider this to be sort of a,
and wouldn't consider it to be an emergency,
but it would probably be heard at a show.
Cause hearing could take two to four weeks
to even get scheduled for a show cause hearing.
And then that doesn't even mean a decision
is made at that time.
You know, in the past we've had
these hearings move a little quicker.
'cause those are election related issues. Okay.
And other than, but this one
would probably move a little bit slower.
Alright, fair enough. I I just wanted
to see if we could get it in
before the, the meeting of the third. If I may,
I may just do, do the civil, I'm see,
I'm seeing the civil service rules for the first time.
Um, do, would they allow, and Mr.
Gages is here, but if, um,
because this is a special circumstance where we're trying
to work out something, I don't know if it would be the
chairperson of the civil service that would sort
of bend the, uh, submission rule.
Um, instead of, you know, maybe it could be if it's not done
by that date, but it's done by a
Later on Yeah.
Since There are commission,
we can always do a special meeting or whatever it may be.
We can speak his, uh, Terry, we can speak to the chairperson
and see what we can get going.
Okay. That would be, that would be,
I'm with everyone here. I just
wanna get a mediation and get this all done for Ms.
Barnwell, uh, mayor
Stone. Okay. But
that, that sounds good to me. Then.
Can you restate the motion, please? Mayor?
I will, uh, support Ms.
Moore's amendment for, uh, a letter from city attorney
and mediation and, uh,
as an amendment to the original motion.
And we're going to approve an attorney tonight and approve
Attorney as, as stated in the original
Motion. It's not gonna work.
Okay. That's fine. We vote No.
You can vote. No. Any other, uh, no,
no more discussion. Well,
I'm going, my discussion is I don't wanna approve an
attorney until we get the mediation within two weeks.
If we can do this within two weeks
and find out by our next meeting, then we can move forward
with her, with an attorney if we move forward.
It's contingent hiring.
The attorney is contingent on the outcome
of the mediation. Okay. And if there's no
Decision, we'll know in two weeks? Yes.
Yes. Okay.
Yes, we put a deadline on it,
and so it would not, there would be no hire of an attorney
unless there's no decision made in that amount of time.
And we will find out with that two weeks.
She has to know we're serious. Yes.
This is the way to do it. Yes. Okay.
I'm going to call the question. Um, Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr.
Lafferty? Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan?
Yes. Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries.
Next item. Thank you Ms. Barlow. Thank you so much.
Next item. Next item is 12 C consideration
and adoption of a resolution
authorizing the city attorney's office
to enter into consent agreements regarding marijuana,
marijuana license renewals following payment
of delinquent taxes.
So moved with discussion support.
L Um, Madam Chair, if I could ask Mr. Schroeder
to please explain this.
Certainly. Um, the city council received two appeals,
uh, from marijuana, um,
processors I believe in the city, um, that
were denied their renewal
because they were behind on their taxes.
In the meantime, they have paid their taxes
and they filed an appeal.
They timely filed that appeal.
And the question is, how do we handle this?
So I've talked to the city attorney's office, I've talked
with Council Secretary Moore, I've talked
with the public service director.
I've talked with the zoning inspector who's close with, uh,
the marijuana licensees.
And the recommendation I made was that we follow
what the state of Michigan does when its licensees
fall behind on their taxes.
And that is to authorize the city attorney's office
with the consent of the public service director
to reinstate their license
if they paid their delinquent taxes
by the time they filed the appeal.
And in this particular case,
I understand these two licensees did do that,
and I looked up one of 'em.
They had a $52,000 summer tax bill, so they paid it,
and I think they paid the
penalty and interest along with it.
So that's just for one licensee, 52,000
into the city's coffers.
Um, the other option is just to deny their license,
and there's no incentive to pay the taxes.
They fall on arrears, they leave and go to another city.
But this is actually the process
that the state uses when licensees fall
behind on their state taxes.
The state will non-renew their license.
They can appeal that non-renewal.
And in that time period, if they pay up on their taxes,
they renew their license.
And, um, unfortunately this does happen.
Um, and, uh, again, it's a good way
to incentivize the payment of taxes.
Now, obviously, if they don't pay that
by the time the appeal time is due,
then they're not gonna be able to take advantage of this.
So this ensures that all the summer taxes
or whatever taxes are behind on are paid in the same year.
So this is not a let letting someone fall
behind one or or two or three years.
This really is only letting someone fall
behind depending on when the renewal is up,
less than a year, and they have to come fully up to speed.
So I would, I would recommend it.
Um, and future licensees know that they're gonna have
to pay up and it's gonna have
to be, you know, during that year.
Um, Madam Chair, um, Mr.
Mr. Schroeder, um, I didn't read every line of this,
but, um, I think in, in certain circumstances I've heard
that, um, there's a,
I think there's a 90 day letter that goes out.
Is that on this one about,
maybe I'm confused
because, uh, there's a, there's been a notice issue.
Mr. Mr. Melli, thank you.
Good evening Counsel. Um, we automate,
or we're in the process of automating a six month notice
that lets 'em know that they're, they're, I'm sorry,
a three month notice that lets 'em know
that their license is about to expire.
We're not in the habit of teaching people
how to run their businesses.
They should know how to pay their property taxes
and how to get their business license renewed.
Um, before they were let called every two weeks
and told, Hey, your bus, your license has expired.
You had to pay this, you gotta pay that.
This has been a common practice with them that, you know,
they let their taxes go.
We're not, we're not letting that practice go anymore.
They all got a letter last year from me that stated
that if at the time of renewal they were
behind in property taxes,
that their license would be suspended.
And we have a legal obligation to report that to the CRA.
So they've all been informed. It's in their renewal packet.
It's in the new license packet.
They all know that this is, it states in their license,
it states in the, the, the state's license that if they have
to be, that they can't be in arrears on, uh, to the city,
to the state for anything.
They have to be, you know, current.
So we're just abiding or going by the law
and we're holding everybody to the same plateau.
Gotcha. We need to have you in charge of the commissions
around this city because there's a lot of, uh,
default going on in members of our commission.
So Madam President, they know very well.
They're supposed to be in compliance.
Thank you very much, Mr. Newnan. Yes.
Um, none of these are, um, these are, are, uh,
retail operations.
These, the ones currently that are on, in front
of you are Grow ops, but this goes
for retail operations as well.
They're grow ops. Okay.
So the one thing I wanted to know for sure is
that they haven't violated the air quality standards.
However, however, that's put because I'm driving down Hoover
and I smell big marijuana smell every time I get down,
you know, around nine mile.
What's before you tonight?
Just, just deals with the tax violations. Yeah.
Anything, anything else, else will be an additional that'll
still come before council.
So this will just allow us to get the people
that were back on are behind on taxes.
Right. That doesn't have, so you don't have to deal
with every single one.
If they are behind with other stuff, they'll still have
to go through the zoning and building process
and that those will get brought in front of council.
Okay. Madam Chair. Thanks
Mr. Laff.
Mr. Lafferty, thank you.
Through the chair to Mr. Schroeder.
The resolution for tonight is a one time deal.
This is not in perpetuity for Mr.
Elli or, or the City attorney's office to use as a tool
for all future, uh, uh,
tax arrears.
It actually does give them some authority moving forward,
provided that there's an appeal filed within 14 days
of the notice of non-renewal.
And provided that the taxes are fully paid by that time,
the taxes, interest and penalties are all paid,
and that both the attorney's office
and the public service department agree,
then they can enter into a consent agreement, allowing them
to continue and,
and reinstate that license just on these tax issues only.
But they have to be fully paid up.
There's a narrow window of time
for their, for them to get this done.
Otherwise, counsel will be hearing these appeals. Mm-hmm.
And we wanted to reduce the amount appeals.
In the meantime, while this is occurring, um, Ms.
Michaels and I with Mr.
Melli and Councilman Bokey, we sat months ago
and we have a list of 13
or 14 amendments coming for the, uh, marijuana ordinance.
And we're hoping that this is gonna be an interim
resolution to solve this.
And hopefully
before the end of the year, you'll be able
to vote on a permanent solution in the ordinance.
Okay. So with, with that said, the,
this can be used as a tool in perpetuity.
What I don't want to see is this used as a crutch
by repeat offenders.
We should not give, this should be something, this happens
one time, and we're not enabling businesses
to fall behind year after year, and we have to go
after them and pay your taxes.
Pay your taxes. I'm, I'm not in that business.
I'm not in that business of, of it was said perfectly,
teaching others how to run their business.
If you can't pay your taxes, you shouldn't be in business.
But this, I think this is a very, uh, diligent, uh,
mechanism to solve this problem.
I think it, in reducing the,
the hearings is absolutely the right thing to do.
I just don't want this to be a crutch
for businesses in the future.
Oh, well, I I can always go through this
and get away with it for a while and, and postpone it.
That's not what this is for.
This is to solve the, the immediate problem
and enable, enable the city to collect
without being punitive.
So as, as long as we're not enabling businesses
to use this, you know,
Over and over and over again, Councilman Lafferty.
Um, I think that you hit a good point there.
One, one thing, if counsel wishes, you could amend you,
you know, you could add, uh, an addendum to this resolution
and indicate that as part of the consent agreement, um,
that the licensee acknowledge that this is a one time,
uh, situation, and that they acknowledge
that their taxes are
to be paid timely in the following year.
I, I would accept that I would make that amendment
to the resolution, uh, exactly as stated
Support That Ms. Moore,
you support that Yes.
Amendment as long as Mr. Schroeder's in favor.
Can you restate it, please? The amendment?
Yep. Go, Go ahead. The amendment would be that as part
of the consent agreement between the city attorney's office
and the marijuana licensee, um, to reinstate the license,
that the licensee acknowledge that, uh, this
reinstatement is, uh, a one time, you know,
like a one time situation.
And that the licensee acknowledges that they have
to timely pay their taxes next year,
and they're not guaranteed at all to get
a similar treatment in the next year.
That they get an, you know,
basically a signed acknowledgement.
We understand when our taxes are due.
They will be paid next year.
Okay. Thank you. Thank you.
Any other discussion, hearing, and scene?
Then I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty?
Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 12 D.
Request for appeal by Emerald Mountain Labs, the suspension
of marijuana license.
Um, motion to reinstate emerald.
Motion to table. You want me to table this? Yes.
Oh, motion to table
Support to table.
Okay.
There's a motion on the floor,
but we, there's no, um, there's no discussion.
There's no, I know. There's no discussion.
Um, I wouldn't, yeah,
it would be helpful to know what I'm taking.
Can you explain
my
Understanding? Okay.
Um, so the motion in support by Mr.
Lafferty, and this is a motion to table Ms. Moore?
Yes. Mr. Lafferty?
Yes. To table. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. To table. Mr. Bokey?
Yes. Mr. Noonan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. The table Rogan C is a Yes.
Next item 12 E, request for appeal by Boxer Enterprises.
LLC and revocation of municipal license number CAUE 1 48.
My motion to table support
to table call the question.
Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. To table.
Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee? Yes.
Rogan C is a yes.
Motion items table.
Thank you. Um, the next item is
12 f Discussion in Ray Workforce housing pilot
ordinance test run project.
One consideration of an ordinance to create chapter 33.7
of the Warren Code of Ordinance relating
to workforce housing first reading.
And the second part of that is consideration
and adoption of a resolution providing public notice
of intent to sell tax reverted properties at 1 1 0 7 6
and 1 1 0 8.
Two Maxwell Warren, Michigan approving sale upon completion
of notice period and acceptance of grant of easement rights.
Motion to approve with discussion support.
Lafferty, uh, ma Madam chair, I would like to
suspend the rules
and, um, allow spear partners to present,
um, some information about this project.
And I believe if you turn on your screens,
there will be a opposed motion to suspend the rules.
Support. All in favor? Aye. Aye.
Any opposed? Good evening.
Good evening. Thank you Counsel.
Um, my name is John Wright
and I'm joined, uh, by my colleagues,
Nicole Gado Ross and Jim Ross.
Um, I think we have a, someone in the,
it's gonna do our PowerPoint.
My name is Nicole Gadel Ross.
Um, I am partners with John
and I'm actually going to excuse myself
so I can help do the presentation
and then I'll be back for questions if needed.
Great. So, um, yeah, we've been monitoring, uh,
the progress with the Warren Land Bank
and have been encouraged by that.
And so we brought forward some of these ideas and,
and wanted to present them to you.
So we'll wait till we get our tech running here.
Alright, so who are we you met?
Uh, Jim and Nicole and myself.
We've been working together for about 11 years.
Jim and, uh, Jim and Nicole are, uh, live
and work in Macomb County and have grown up here.
And I've been doing business here for just over a decade.
The last time we were in front
of the council actually was in about 10 years ago in 2015,
where we, uh, were part of the group
that bought the a hundred tax, uh,
reverted properties from the city.
And we had a, we were, uh, requested
to fix those up in two years, um,
and put them back in services rental property.
Uh, so we've been a counterparty with the city
before in that manner,
and we, we consider that to be a successful transaction.
We've had about 80 of those homes made it
through the, out of the a hundred lot.
A lot of them had to be torn down,
but we actually still hold those, um, as investors
and, um, continue
to be really invested in the city of Warren.
Just quick stats.
So Nicole and Jim run a property management company.
Between the three of us, we all, we own about 120 houses.
Uh, and Jim and I have worked
for private equity funds buying, uh,
in Southern Macomb County and Warren for a long time.
And Nicole now manages about 230 properties.
So we're, we're vertically integrated, have been,
have been working in the for here for a long time.
Um, we just, as investors, I think we share a lot
of goals with the city.
Um, stable families and no, you know, reduced flight
and improving neighborhoods that we think
that supports the community.
It also, um, helps us and helps our businesses.
So we've got a big idea.
Um, and it's modular build to rent infill housing.
So this is offsite fabrication, not mobile homes,
modular, uh, it's, you know, just as good a quality
as stick build on site.
If, just to compare, um, oh, go,
go back real quick, Nicole.
Um, on the left is really what is
very prevalent in the southern part of Warren.
It's called the, we call it the GI bungalow.
It was built in the 1950s.
I mean, that's a term that's, uh, we didn't create
that term, but basically, um, there's thousands of these
and we will get to a little bit to the history.
We wanna, we want to basically update that.
And with infill, we're calling them millennial modular.
We'll get to that in a second too.
These are open floor plans. We're targeting millennials.
These are modern houses, things we'd all live in.
And we know from your, the city budget
that the city's spending about $2 million annually.
Not maybe not all on those lots concentrated in the
4 8 0 4 8 0 8 9 zip code,
but in maintaining, uh, the vacant properties either
through mow or snow removal or bike control.
So I think that presents, well, that's a problem.
It presents an opportunity as well.
Just to kind of take a look at the current market in the
southern part of Warren, actually, it's pretty interesting.
That area was probably one of the largest concentrations
of naturally affordable workforce housing in the,
in the country at one point, um, after World War ii.
Um, and the creation of the FHA, if you were a developer,
you, you could finance the entire neighborhood.
Uh, if you built these houses to the FHA minimum
and property standards about seven to 900 square feet.
And you had a built in buyer pool of people
with their GI Bill who could also qualify for a VA
or an FHA loan.
We love these houses. We own and manage hundreds of them.
They all have the same layout.
By and large, they're 75 years old
and they've really held up well, but they are 75 years old
and need it's time for some updating.
And what else has been really great in terms of, uh,
a market for with Warren is, look, Detroit
and the Detroit bankruptcy
and the financial crisis really infected the values all
throughout Macomb County.
But the work that the city did to really combat blight
and crime made a huge difference in these neighborhoods.
I know That there's lots of problems,
but just if you take a stand back, it, it,
it actually was very helpful.
Keep going, Nicole.
Maybe Patrick can help
Turn heat on.
I dunno what that is. It doesn't look good
Screen.
The other thing, the other factor that, you know,
the city needs to think about and,
and we think a lot about as, as developers
and investors, is there is a large cohort of millennials
that are looking for attractive housing solutions.
And if we don't find those, they're not gonna stay.
And so we think this also, while
we seems like a problem also presents an opportunity
for new housing Right now
in the southern part of Warren, the, the fiscal
and economic reality is that for sale housing
that's not subsidized really doesn't pencil.
So the average cost
of an onsite stick build house is about $220,000,
give or take, roughly, roughly.
Uh, and the current sale price is
around 1 25 to one 50.
So if you're a developer
or investor, that just doesn't make sense.
So without subsidy, we think,
and also with the higher inter,
with the higher interest rates right now, there's still, uh,
an incentive for renting over buying at the moment.
'cause mortgage mortgages have gone up.
Um, just if you take a look at the pricing right now in this
area, this, this kind of tracks back all the way to the,
uh, financial crisis.
And what, what happened is there was a
huge collapse in the values.
And from call it 2012 to around 2020,
we think the investment community, uh, we did participate.
This really put a floor on the values
and it attracted a lot of out, you know,
out of the area capital.
And that did increase the number of rentals,
but it also maintained the housing stock.
But what has happened, and it, it seemed,
and it's good, it's, we've had a massive inflation period
after COVID, which upped the values of the houses,
but it also re uh, triggered a bunch
of property tax reassessments.
So what that does for the investor community is,
uh, if you wanna go to the next slide,
really squeezes the returns.
So while they, they seemed really great back then,
right now, you know, at a risk adjusted basis, they're not
as compelling as they used to be.
And, you know, that was good for balance sheets,
but not good for, for yields.
And that has basically stopped a lot of purchasing
and most notably a lot
of capital repairs in these rental houses.
So people just can't afford to do it anymore.
We think the city has some levers
to spur spur development.
So one of those things is the first reading tonight,
which is in 2022, the state
of Michigan adopted a workforce housing
payment in lieu program.
So that gave cities like Warren the authority
to adopt this program and,
and allow, uh, payment in lieu
of taxes programs, so payment in lieu.
So service charges based on net shelter rents in lieu
of property tax to incentivize development
for workforce housing, which they call housing for, um,
tenants who are, uh, below 120% a MI.
This is, we're seeing this being
adopted throughout the state.
We were, we participated in, uh, calls
and discussions with city staff here, uh,
with other jurisdictions that are doing this.
And we think this would make,
this would make a huge difference,
obviously putting this forward as an idea in the resolution.
So that's one lever.
The second is for, for new development and rehab,
but we're, we're, tonight
we're talking about new development.
The second is the concept.
And this is not for in front of the council tonight,
but we'll be hopefully, uh, if you'd like
to advance it later this year or maybe early next year.
We're hoping it would be in front
of planning commission in December, which is
a geographic district within the southern part of the city,
which right now is the Patriot Place,
but it's the, the overlay would be the Patriot place
with a little bit to the east, to the East Point border.
That would help us relax some
of the zoning standards in the R one C district
that would allow both more density
and some flexibility on setbacks.
So we can put new houses. And as an example,
the two properties we're asking to purchase tonight
as a test run, just in our initial design, we had to make,
you know, last minute changes to avoid a variance request.
I mean, we're talking a simple 1100 square foot house
and we couldn't fit it on the lot
without a variance request.
So we think
that this overlay district will be a concentrated area.
It's not citywide, but an area where the patriot place now
and where all these lots are
that will allow streamline development.
So just to show you the math of how this would work,
so this is the pilot program on the left.
So these are two graphs of like expenses relative
to your rent and what the, what the NOI is.
So just by the tax abatement
and allowing new construction,
you can see a major decrease from 42% to 25%
of, uh, expenses.
So that is huge for making projects
that don't pencil pencil it, it, that,
that is, that is their math.
There's no getting around that it didn't work for.
If we implement this program, it will work.
We looked through, um, the Warren Master plan
and found several areas
of support we've just cited in this table
and happy to share this broadly with you afterwards
or anyone who's interested.
Uh, the citations, so just the concepts
that we're proposing, zoning reform
and, uh, the missing middle
and using these vacant lots for development.
So just a little bit about
how this process is going to work.
So we are talking modular.
Um, we are going to use Champion Homes
as our partner initially.
They are a Troy based, uh, public company.
You'll see a, uh, visit Jim, Nicole
and I, uh, several others visited the
factory back in September.
This is where our houses will come from.
Also, Fay Bakkers houses are gonna come from these same, uh,
same, uh, factory.
This place can pump out nine of these a day.
Obviously that's a lot.
We're not gonna be doing nine a day,
but this starts with flooring
and it goes off the line in one day
and then two days later it will ship to our site
and we'll crane it onto the foundation.
So, we'll, we'll still, we'll di uh, dig the foundations
and the utility trench that's still a, uh, a city permit,
normal pro site permit,
but the actual approval
of the modular housing building permit runs
through the state clearing agency out of Lara.
So it's kind of cool just
they literally truck this thing in.
We pull a crane, we put it on the foundation,
we connect the utilities.
You could actually sleep there that night.
It's totally, uh, watertight.
Uh, and then we'll pour drive away and landscape.
Then we have an inspection with the city
and then we get, you know, the CFO.
That's the process. We're talking three days from
construction to delivery
and then probably another five days we would be able
to get a permit and, and get it in there.
An occupancy permit 'cause
of the driveway and the landscaping.
That's in Incre, incredible savings.
And we're seeing about a 35% savings from, uh,
stick built on site construction.
Um, we love that. This is a warren,
we love this as a hometown company.
They do too. They're watching this hearing tonight.
They're very excited about this.
They think this is a, um, model for, uh,
infill projects both here in Warren, throughout Michigan,
throughout the Midwest actually.
Um, and they just have a fondness because it is more,
and it's the hometown here.
Um, we're, we don't wanna over promise.
Um, we want to kind of over underpromise, over deliver.
So this is just a conceptual schedule showing
if you do approve this pilot framework
and sell us these lots, um,
and grant us these zoning changes, we we can move quickly.
So we'll, we'll hit winter weather in December
and we hit the Frost Law,
but we'll use that period of time next year to get all
of our entitlement and design work done for lots, um,
for some of these vacant, for these vacant lots.
And then we will construct
for about 32 weeks in the year you can construct.
So we'll be digging foundations and setting them.
Um, and then that can run just in terms of we're, if,
if we're successful, if we can continue to attract capital
that can run into next in the 2027 as well.
So we're developers and investors.
We've given you a lot of numbers
as we've been giving this presentation.
Some have asked us to give our policy view so
we're not elected officials, we're just gonna give you to
what, how we see it on the ground.
So we think that, um, first of all, the way
to frame this issue is it's not renter versus owner.
It's about housing quality.
And right now there's not a lot of quality options.
In 4 8 0 8 9, there's new, there's, there's rentals
that are been flipped and turned over and are good,
but they're, they're, they're GI bungalows.
Um, and so we think that an equitable housing policy
recognizes that not everyone is gonna own their home
and is not in a position to do that,
but they still deserve a quality house.
And right now we have a very aging housing stock down there.
And we think that,
we think the Patriot Place program was very,
a really innovative program
with the home ownership, uh, initiative.
And, but we think that if we just focus on
for sale programs, that it kind
of ignores the live realities for a lot of Warren residents
because a lot of them are rentals or renters.
And if we just keep always focusing on these home ownership
programs, it's just not gonna, it,
it just hasn't catalyzed the investment to date.
Now I think we think that if we go to the next slide,
actually, what can really happen here is
if we suddenly have a lot of new housing stock in this area,
that is going to create an an interesting self
reinforcing cycle where we think the values in this
area are gonna go up.
So at the end of our rental period, we would love
to sell the, we, we,
we said this when we bought the a hundred in 2015.
We would love to sell those to retail owner.
We'd love to sell them to owner occupants.
That's probably better economics for us than
to just sell them to another investor
or to hold them as investments forever.
And we think that, you know, this will raise the standards.
The other thing I think is going to happen is if we
suddenly can have new construction,
rental property down there, that is going to put a lot
of pressure on current landlords, including ourselves,
to have very quality.
'cause it's gonna be a marketplace for good tenants.
And people are gonna say, why would I want to go
to this non updated house that has a lot of old, you know,
disrepair when I can go to something brand new?
That's, that's our case.
So really we think, we know,
warned does have a larger renter prop population.
We can't wish that away. We think the question
for this council is, do we want to continue
in these older deteriorating homes,
or do we want better well-managed homes?
And we wanna offer that solution if you'll work with us.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you. Mad chair.
Yes. Um, so,
or originally, um, I was brought into discussions, um,
with this group, um, John and Nicole
and, um, John, um, whether this was something
that the Land Bank could be involved in,
and I have been attending conferences and webinars,
and there's some things I've learned
through the Land Bank process.
Number one, no one can build anything at market rate today
without some incentives.
It's just impossible.
Number two, there's an extreme lack
of affordable work workforce housing.
There's incentives all over the,
the state is offering incentives for things to do.
Um, the other thing that I found out,
I was very misinformed on some things
because I thought the end all be all would be
to provide homes for people to own.
And there are very many people in this country,
in this state, in this city that don't wanna be homeowners.
They wanna be renters. That's what they choose.
And, um, that was sort of a, an eye-opening,
uh, thing for me.
Um, the other thing to be successful zoning is,
is imperative, especially when we're dealing
with 30 foot lots and, um, the like.
And, um, you know, one of the things we've talked about
with Land Bank is, you know, tiny homes and others
and duplexes, maybe some spots
where we have room and things like that.
Um, and the, um, I had a, I was on a,
a, um, a modular home, uh, learning
group and found that one of the best uses
of modular homes are on scattered lots.
That while they, um, can be done contiguous, um,
they're not as easy and they're a lot of problems.
And really the best use
of the modular construction are exactly
what you're proposing, which is infill
on different size lots.
And, um, I think all of us realize
that rentals have been a problem in Warren at times.
It's the people that are renting them,
and it's the quality of the houses.
The houses are dilapidated, there's problems with it.
But just imagine moving into a brand new home
that's going to be open concept, um, modern,
and you are able to rent that.
And I think that is just a wonderful opportunity
that's gonna come to our city.
I'm certainly in favor of it.
Um, I like the idea that you are going to build two pilot,
um, homes, um, so that we can all see how that works.
Um, modular homes don't come without some problems.
Um, transport here is, uh, you know, they come down the road
and they shake a little bit,
but that's problems you have to deal
with once it gets on the property.
I understand that. Um, also I've heard, uh, from, uh, some
of the things, uh, classes I've taken is that, uh,
that they're, that
and scattered, they're much easier to put in.
The infrastructure is easy
and a lot of times it's already there.
Um, so I think this is really for us, sort
of the perfect answer for some of the problems we're having.
We have, um, you, you know, Patriot was a hundred,
149 lots or something like that.
We have hundreds more vacant lots.
Um, and, you know, the Land Bank wants to do something, um,
with those, and we plan on it.
There's some incentives for us,
and we're gonna be reaching out pretty soon
to do some things there.
But I think that, um, this is a great idea.
Um, and, um, I look forward to
seeing what you can do.
Uh, you talked about the GI Bill
and those houses, so many houses
where people bought them under the GI Bill.
My family actually was the, um, management broker
for the Veterans Administration from 1965
until 2009 in Warren.
And oh, we had, uh, Detroit east of Woodward
and Macomb County.
So we handled every repossession of every house
that was under the VA GI loan.
So, um, we saw those houses from the six, from,
from 1965.
And that, you know, certainly they changed.
We at one time repaired every house that we repossessed,
but at that, at one point the government stopped doing that.
Um, but, and that was the way, the government's way of
making these homes, um, you know, bringing them back
so that when they sold them, then this was the house
that was up to code.
Every house was up
to code while the government stopped doing that.
And I think that hurt cities like ours,
certainly in Detroit,
because, you know, we had, um, plasterers,
electricians, every trade you could think of
that were going into all these homes
and bringing them up to code.
People don't do that anymore.
Um, when a bank comes
and takes a house, they don't bring it up to code,
they dump it or whatever.
And so that, unfortunately, we're sort of a byproduct of
that, you know, the, the repossessions
and just sold to somebody.
And they were sold as is
where people often didn't have the
wherewithal to bring it up.
So I think that bringing in new homes that'll be rentals
owned by a, uh, and,
and managed in a company that we know very well that has,
that you're a part of, that's a very, very, uh,
a good partner for us to have.
You have a very good relationship and Warren,
and you pay your bills.
We know that. Um, not everybody does.
And we appreciate that. So that, that's my 2 cents. Mr.
Schroeder's met with you, um, more than me,
and he might have some things to offer.
Um, so maybe this is the time for you to
Sure. Um,
chair
Mr. Newnan and then
Mr. Lafferty. Oh.
Um, but Mr. Shorter, if you have
Something to add. Yeah, certainly. I,
I think just the things I think counsel
would want to know, we've met several times.
Um, we've had several Zoom meetings
with not just the city.
We've talked with Detroit and Grand Rapids
and other communities, um, especially was impressed.
Mr. Wright came and we visited with the attorney's office,
assessing and planning all on the same day.
And, you know, tried
to get everybody on the same page about this.
They were very productive meetings.
Um, and, uh, you know, they're,
they're well-known quantity here, which,
which was impressive to me.
And then we worked on creating this draft ordinance here,
this pilot ordinance.
Um, it was sampled from other communities, you know,
for example, we talked to one other city
and the person gave us a frank assessment
and said, don't over-regulate or overburden this,
and you're creating more work for your staff.
And in one city, the city council wanted everything to come
before them so they could vote it up or down.
And it was just bogging down the process.
So we learned a lot from other communities, uh, about
what to do and what not to do.
And the approach that's being taken here is a strong,
solid ordinance that allows a resolution to be passed for
this project and for the future projects.
So, um, so I think everything went very well.
Um, you know, I, I, um, tonight just
what you're voting on is the first reading
of the pilot ordinance, which is an enabling ordinance
to permit this test run.
And so the council, it, it allows both the council
and the developer to make an assessment.
Like, instead of committing to dozens
or hundreds of lots to do this, you get to see how it looks,
how it works, and what the pitfalls are.
So, you know, maybe it doesn't work.
Um, I think it's going to, um, but we have to wait and see.
So it's, it's a test run.
So council's gonna have another opportunity to move forward
with a larger project if this works.
And also there's a resolution authorizing the sale
of these two lots, which I
believe are adjacent to each other.
And they worked very hard to try
to make sure these homes fit on the lot
and didn't have to get a zoning variance.
Can you imagine dozens and dozens
and of zoning variances, having to go to the zoning board
of appeals, trying to avoid that.
We heard about the zoning overlay. This is being proposed.
This has to come through planning
and the planning commission before it comes to council.
It's not needed for this test run,
but it's an absolute necessity if this is ever gonna be
considered, um, in the future.
Um, when I first heard modular,
I was a little bit concerned about it,
but then, um, when I was on Mackinac Island
for the policy conference this year, I was off walking
and taking in the scenery
and I saw them bringing this modular home on this bluff
that was overlooking the Mackinac Bridge.
And I was like a modular home on Macaw Island.
They're like, oh yeah, this works great.
And I talked to the, uh, neighbors
and they were telling me all about it.
So it's good enough for Mackinac Island
to overlook the Mackinac Bridge.
It must be good for Warren.
So, uh,
I can answer any other questions you have about the
legalities, but that's the background.
Many, many meetings have taken place
and this was certainly an outgrowth of the Land Bank
and we're glad that it's happening.
And the Land Bank too, we can work with the developer
through the Land Bank if this gets
to be a bigger project as well.
Thank you, Mr. Schroer. Mr. Newan, and then Mr. Lafferty.
Thank you. Yes. Uh, I am, um, in general in favor of this,
uh, this type of work.
Very much so. Um, we, uh,
in general, I think we have many neighborhoods that have
too many rental houses
where the renters aren't taking care of the properties.
And I'd like to have a better mechanism for making sure
that the properties get taken care of by the landowners,
the, the, uh, owners or by the, by the tenants.
Um, I also have a concern about formaldehyde
and pre-constructed, uh, houses.
I know that, um, when, uh, FEMA was like helping to rebuild
in, uh, in Mississippi, I think it was Louisiana.
Oh, well, uh, a lot of the, a lot
of the prefab houses had a lot of formaldehyde.
And I'm, I, I'm glad to hear
that there's energy efficiency considered.
Um, it seems to me that if anything, it'd be nice to have
even higher standards that we're building
to considering what I think is coming.
Um, but, um, what I really,
I was trying to read through what, um, what was prepared
by Attorney Schroeder.
And, um, I saw things, words like, um,
neighborhood enterprise zone, Nez known as Patriot Place,
um, and, uh, add valorem tax abatement.
And, um, let's see, what was it?
Uh, an annual service charge
for public services in lieu of all such taxes.
I didn't really understand who's benefiting, who's paying,
and, um, how that works out.
I, I, it has to be some kind of subsidy as far
as I can make out in some other kind of, uh, verbiage.
But, uh, would you care to,
Let me get, take a stab at that.
Go ahead. Um, yeah, council member, we'll, um,
on your question on the, on the formaldehyde
and, uh, can we come back
and on that too, just to ensure that, you know,
give you what's in the building materials next time
for the next reading or email
that to you have to do that. Sure.
They just had that, uh, Katrina, I think I know
what you're talking about with those.
They're definitely a much better quality home than Yeah.
What you may have heard about. Yeah.
They use, uh, bat installation and
Blown in install. Speaking of the microphone, please.
I'm sorry. Yes. Uh, at the factory when I went there, uh,
with the group, uh, they use bat insulation
and they use blown in installation.
Same thing they do on new construction.
Well, they also do, uh, spray foam,
but the factory, they use bat and blown in installation.
So they don't use the spray foam.
Oh, that's good. Well,
Yeah, you can see it in the pictures.
The, uh, formal apparently was often used in laminates.
Yeah. Or, uh, com compound, what is it?
Uh, pressed wood products and stuff. Yeah.
And I imagine there're gonna be some of those in there. Yes.
But you're gonna, you're gonna come back to,
you're gonna come back to
Us. Yeah. We'll come provide
a
building materials kind of summary.
'cause I don't want to have poisoned, uh, citizens. We
Don't wanna have poisoned.
Thank you for that. About the foam.
Um, and when it comes to the, to how the, uh,
economics of this works out, it is a subsidy
because you no, no one can really afford to build a house
with the way the prices are
that's affordable for the workforce.
Right. So we, we have to figure out how to lower that price.
The, the pay, the payment in lieu
of tax is a pilot concept, has been around
for a long time in the, you know,
truly affordable housing space
where you're receiving government monies
of some sort or subsidy.
What's new and innovative here?
So how that works is, instead
of paying the Avalor property tax,
which would be assessed on like the typical way it's
assessed and then, uh, charged to a property owner,
the way this works is the landlord, the owner
of the property comes forward each year
and presents, uh, a copy of certified copy
of their financials to say this is the amount of revenue
and rent we collected for this.
And the pilot is a service charge on the net shelter rent.
So like the total rent rental revenue cost.
So 4% of the, the charge,
what you pay in your quote property tax,
what you would consider your property taxes is a 4% service
charge on your rents.
That's how, that's how it works.
4% service charge on the rent Yeah.
Versus, versus your typical assessed property tax.
So we, we present the, the way this works is the
landlord presents a certified copy of their leases
and their rental revenue each year
to the treasurer's office.
And a copy of their resolution says, okay, on this,
on this property, uh, the
res there's a pilot resolution authorizing an X percent
charge on your net shelter rents.
So they just multiply that percentage times
the gross net shelter rents.
And that's what you pay in taxes each year.
And, and, and make sure that, um,
the schools still get their full taxes. Right.
Well then the net the, the
pilot is distributed the same way the
property taxes are distributed.
However, those mills are distributed by statute
or ordinance, whatever governs that.
That's how it's distributed to each.
So in this case,
the vacant lots the city owns are produ have no tax,
there's no revenue from that.
So it would actually, while it's less than
what would be charged if it didn't have a pilot,
it's going from zero to something basically. Right. Yeah.
Okay. So that's a, that's a plus for the city. Yeah.
And, um, okay.
So the schools will get more than they would've
gotten had there been nothing there.
Exactly. So
Everyone, we should be happy too.
They're not gonna be unhappy.
Yeah. Every entity that's receiving revenue from those
will be getting more than zero. Okay.
Sounds real good. Thanks Mr.
Lafferty. Thank you. Good evening.
And just a couple of, uh, follow up questions.
Uh, understand the ordinance, the,
the homes you had mentioned, uh, inspection.
These homes are subject to state and local inspection.
The, the, the way the modular housing approvals work is
that the modular manufacturer
seeks an approval at the state level for
what is the traditional,
like corn shell building permit for a house.
Um, so that's approved.
And actually the Warren Building Department
is very familiar with this process.
We, we, we went to them and they were like, yes,
we understand how that works.
So you, they submit, it's under Laura, it's a, uh,
a division under la you receive your state approval,
but we have to dig a foundation and dig utility trenches
and do landscaping in a driveway.
All that, that is all under a site permit,
a traditional site permit
through the city building department.
Alright. So then that follows up with a,
a local inspection
by the building department, city building depart. You get
The occupancy permit. And
then if once we turn, you know, once we're renting it,
it's obviously subject to annual
rental inspection as well. Yeah.
Every, every two years, the rental, um,
every two years we would complete the
rental certificate through
The rental department. Same process. Yeah.
Alright. Now we're not mandating rental.
These could be owner occupied. Correct. Alright.
So that, that's an option. Yeah.
And under the, the ordinance, do we have the,
the standard 12 month, uh, rental limitation,
nothing under 12 months.
Maybe that's a follow up.
Uh, and typically that's what we have with the, uh,
the sale of tax reverted properties.
We have a, a limitation standards is 12 months now.
So with that,
and then assuming that we don't have anything,
I think Mr. Schroeder, you mentioned the zoning ordinances,
the zoning ordinance that will accompany this
regulatory or ordinance.
'cause we have to give the building
department a script to follow.
Right. For what they have to inspect. Mm-hmm.
So the zoning ordinance will follow this at some point.
It's going through planning. You said
The zoning overlay district that was being,
is being proposed mm-hmm.
Has to come through planning.
It's not necessary for the two test run properties
because they don't need variances.
This zoning overlay will be in the area described in the
presentation that will relax some
of the zoning setback standards so
that they can take these homes, put 'em on the lots,
and not have to go get a variance for, you know,
small variances to make it work.
That will come to council as part of, I guess phase two
of this, if the developer
and the city decide to move forward
and have a larger project.
Okay. But from a, a perspective of utilities, uh,
city water, sewer connections, those are all standard.
Standard. Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah.
So it doesn't matter the type of home that we're putting on,
we're, we're not changing those standards.
So you would inspect it the same way you'd inspect a
standardized standard built home?
Correct. Okay.
If I just will mention our timeline, we we're, we're,
we actually are hoping to set these first two houses subject
to your approval, subject
to us getting a permit from the city, um,
second week of December.
So we will be getting a lot of feedback fast
on the first two runs,
and that will inform our kind
of phase two plans on cost and process.
Okay. Thank you. I don't have any question.
You been president? I'm sorry, I forgot a question.
I have a couple back to Sure.
Um, so you all, um, do you classify yourself
as a private equity company?
Uh, Yes. We will be, you know, raising capital,
raising private capital.
Okay. Um, and you currently, you said previously you've,
you have over a hundred rentals in the city.
Yeah, that's, um, so that's like our,
our personal ownership.
I, Jim and I, um, I worked
for a private equity fund about 10 years ago.
That's when we did the, the, um, a hundred,
a hundred lot purchase.
So that was, that was a bigger private equity fund.
This is us. Sure.
The, the one 20 is us and this deal will be us.
We're, we're going out and raising
money from people we know.
So we, so we have a huge issue with private equity
companies in the city in general.
Um, they've bought up some of our mobile home parks.
They've purchased large swaths
of tax reverted properties back, um,
during the housing slump.
And very difficult to track any of these LLCs.
A lot of them are, um, not good, uh, landlords.
So I don't know if it's possible to see,
and I don't know if this is feasible for Mr.
Melli, like a history of some, sorry.
I, uh, if, if it's possible to see any kind of, um,
rental history, if these folks, some
of your properties you previously owned, um, you know,
had you were not cooperative with the city and
or you all did not service the renters in those homes
appropriately before we'd approve a larger project,
I would love to see, um, your track record
of renting in the city
before we granted you some larger amount of property.
I think this is a great opportunity for the city,
and I'm sure it's going to serve some housing need.
And we certainly need innovation, um,
in solving the housing crisis in this country,
but also, um, looking at these areas in, in our community
that we know need new developments in order
to spur additional development.
So I'm very, I'm, I'm happy to see this as something
that we're, we're moving forward,
but really would wanna understand your track record in the
city before I would prevent anything larger.
We'd love to show it to you. Okay.
Madam Chair, private equity firms.
I completely understand your concern with that.
I mean, we are private investors. We always laugh.
We have more invested into the city
of Warren than we do our own homes.
Um, and we do have a great reputation with the city
and would continue to maintain that for sure.
Okay. Did that chair, Mr. Newnan, and then Ms. Moore,
Uh, what I forgot to ask for was, um, question if you,
if you could have a rent to own, I'd have a preference
for your rentals being rent to own by far
because, uh, we need to increase the ownership
and, uh, that about a hundred percent of the people
who voted for me would say so.
So it's a, it's a high, high interest point for me.
Thank you. I yield to, uh,
Mindy, Ms. Moore, mad chair.
Um, just, uh, one comment about champion homes.
Um, every land bank that spoke in all
of my experience is touted champion as really the go-to
and the, and the best, um, manufacturer
of the modular homes.
So they really, really have a great reputation.
Um, and before we met with you,
we knew your history here in Lauren
or we wouldn't have given you the time of day.
So we were well aware of that.
We were well of, well aware, well aware of your history
of paying your taxes.
I think you were walking down to the treasurer's office
that day with a check bigger than I could lift probably.
But anyway, we, we did our homework
before we ever sat down, certainly as the Land Bank, so,
and we appreciate that.
Thank you. Any other discussion?
Madam Chair? Mr. Lafferty?
I answered my own question in the second resolution.
It specifies it's under the, the agreements
for the conveyance that the properties are not to be used
for short term rental or lease periods less than 12 months.
Excellent. I will, hearing
and seeing no additional comment
or discussion, I will
call the question.
This is item 12. FF one? Yeah. F1.
And Ms. Moore and Ms. Laffey with a motion in support? Yes.
Uh, Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr.
Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee? Yes.
Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item. Next item.
Um, motion to approve Item five two
or F two 12 F
two. Support. Anyone
Support Lafferty?
Thank you. Discussion, hearing, and scene?
None on call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty?
Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes.
Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 12 G.
Um, which is a resolution adopting towing storage
and administrative fees
for regulated wrecker vehicles in the city of Warren.
Um, to approve the, um, in addition to the towing list,
um, we had not considered ev vehicle
storage, uh, previously.
That has, uh, come up as an issue that we need
to, uh, deal with.
Um, there are certain, uh, state rules
that mandate the storage of ev ve vehicles,
which enclo includes a, uh, cement enclosure.
And the, uh, vehicles must be monitored for seven days.
So there, there's an increased, um, um, expense
and with the monitoring and all of that.
Um, I made some calls around town today
and got prices anywhere from, um, 60 to a hundred.
Um, a local, uh, uh, one of our local tours here, uh,
uh, suggested 75.
So kind of cutting it in the middle.
We put 75 down as the daily fee for EV vehicles just
because they presented a unique, um, challenge.
So I would make a motion to approve.
Do, um, Mr. Schroeder, are we approving the resolution along
with what are
We doing? The resolution
approves the amended
towing storage administrative fee, uh, schedule.
The schedule is attached.
The only thing different
between the schedule you approved in July of 2024,
and this is the addition of two G proposing
that electric vehicles have a daily storage rate of $75.
Okay. So my motion would be to approve that
resolution support Lafferty.
Any other discussion? Hearing scene? None.
I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee?
Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item. Thank you.
Um, next item is discussion, uh, regarding commissions.
That's my item as l. Motion to approve discussion.
Support laborer. HH. Yes. H. Yeah.
I write, I can't write. It's okay. Um, so you made a motion.
Yes. Motion. Mr. Lacker, you did your support.
I supported Thank you. Discussion with Yes, I would.
Uh, although the commissions are listed on the city website,
the expiration of the term
of the commissioners is not listed.
Um, and I think that that should be listed.
What I would ask at this point is a comprehensive list from
the, um, mayor's office
or whoever is handling the appointment so
that we have each commission, um, the commission member,
and when their term expires, so
that the public knows they may be
interested in a commission.
Um, I real, I understand there are some, uh, people that,
uh, their commission, their term has expired.
Those need to be reappointed
or somebody new taking care of that.
Um, and I do wanna bring something up.
Several years ago,
the Warren City Council passed an ordinance creating a
Veteran's advisory and Memorial Commission,
I think it was three years ago.
Yeah. A commission meant to honor, support
and advocate for the men
and women who have served our country.
It has now been more than three years since
that ordinance was adopted
and not one appointment has been made.
Not one. The commission was intended to be a service
to those who have sacrificed for our freedoms.
The continued refusal of the mayor
to make even a single appointment is deeply disturbing
and frankly, inexcusable.
Our veterans deserve better.
There's an event coming up
that perfectly illustrates why this
commission is so important.
Wreaths across America.
For those who may not be familiar,
this is a national event held every December across the
country where volunteers lay wreaths on the graves
of veterans to honor their service
and remember their sacrifice.
For many years, that effort here in Warren has been
coordinated by the Historical Commission.
But this is exactly the kind of project
that should fall under the Veterans Commission
because it speaks directly to remembrance, respect,
and gratitude for our veterans.
I don't know if everyone knows,
but we apparently own a cemetery.
Um, I'm not sure when the deed passed to the city,
but sometime in the last 15 years, probably.
Um, and there are very many veterans in
that cemetery.
And, um, the Historical Commission didn't do it
for the last couple years.
I'm not sure why. Um, maybe lack of membership on
that commission, but this really should be something the
veterans takes care of.
And as we all know, veterans Day is just around the corner
for the past six years.
But maybe one, the city council has organized a small event
to recognize our veterans,
and we are doing so again this year.
It's something we're proud to do,
but this is exactly the type of event
where the Veterans Advisory
and Memorial Commission could play a vital role, helping
to plan, coordinate,
and strengthen our city's commitment to those who served.
Mayor, please do your job.
That is all we are asking. Do your job.
I do want to commend Mr. Elli.
He has taken care of the, uh,
memorial in the best way he could.
Um, and, uh, Mr.
Uh, hick, former city employee, vet Vietnam veteran,
a member of the, uh, veterans Memorial Committee, uh,
from the very beginning along, I was one
of the early members as well, uh,
back in the early two thousands.
Um, but it needs to be maintained.
Our veterans deserve it, our residents deserve it.
And I am just appalled that no one,
not one appointment has been made.
If you've made one, send it over to us.
You don't have to wait till you have a full board of,
uh, commission members.
I would also like to request, um, any final
or draft document prepared associated with the,
uh, elected officials Compensation commission, uh, with
excluding any of the mayor's notes.
I don't want any of the mayor's personal impressions
or anything she wrote down or her notes.
Uh, we're entitled to it if we wanna,
but that's, I don't wanna invade that,
but I would like, if there was any document prepared
with the list of appointees, a list of, uh, potential people
that were gonna be sent over, um,
I would like that document.
Um, I think the mayor has 10 days to respond
to anything council requests.
So that would be my motion, uh, to ask for the, uh,
commission members expiration dates to be included.
I think that's an easy thing to do.
Uh, we've sent over ours for ZBA
and I don't know whether they are actually on the website.
Um, we sent 'em over and they weren't on.
And whether we asked them again
to put those expiration dates on, um, I'd have to check.
I haven't, uh, e it's, it's kind of hard
to find commissions on the website.
It's not easy. But I would ask for that.
I would also ask for any documentation prepared in, uh,
surrounding the elected officials compensation.
And I would implore the mayor to please appoint members
to the Veteran's Advisory and a Memorial Commission.
I think it's time and I think it's very unfair
that it's not been done.
Thank you. So that's my motion.
Madam Chair support,
Uh, Mr. Lafferty.
Yeah. Through the chair to Ms. Moore.
The first part of your motion to ask
for the commission members and their expiration dates.
Uh, I would recommend that we ask
that from the clerk's office who is the custodian
of those records of when the oath was given.
And they would know, the clerk will know, uh,
what the term was.
I'm not certain that the, the mayor's office, uh,
would be able to provide the exact dates.
Well, let's send, um, to both, uh, we could ask the clerk
for any, um, uh, notification of appointment.
Um, I think they keep in a log book.
It might be, I don't know if it'd be a lot of work
for the mayor to go for the clerk's office to go through
every line item of that or what kind of records they keep.
I, I really don't know. I don't wanna make it a,
a burdensome, um, uh, chore on the part of the,
um, clerk's office.
But, um, I would, we can send it to the clerk's office.
And the mayor, certainly the mayor, um, it's,
it's her, uh, her duty.
She knows when she sent a, she's got a copy
of the letter she sent to the clerk.
'cause she has to send the, a notification of the clerk
before it comes to council.
So the clerk should have a letter
or the mayor, they should have,
I would think they would have a list of each commission.
And when they expire, I mean, I
Dunno, I, I, Pardon me, terms are listed.
Oh, they are? Yeah. Of all of them
or just ZBA Oh, ZBA terms are listed, but no other.
Okay. So we've made sure that our, um,
um, ones are listed
Yeah. As evidence lately.
I don't have a lot of trust
with the information coming outta the mayor's
Office. Well, we can
try, right? We can try. Yeah. Thank you Mr.
Lafferty. Thank you. Any other discussion, Madam Chair?
One more comment on that. Yes.
Um, so we have witnessed a, uh, violation
of the charter recently.
Uh, actually violation of state law.
A new item or No, it's commissions. Okay.
It's appointing on commissions.
And, uh, the failure on the part of the mayor is a,
was a violation of the city charter.
The city charter establishes clear penalties for violations
of its provisions.
Um, the mayor violated
and continues to be in violation
of certain sections of the charter.
I would respect, uh, I would re uh,
respectfully request a formal legal opinion from our, uh,
attorney regarding the appropriate course of action
to address these violations.
Specifically, I would like guidance
on whether the city council should initiate an investigation
and establish a charter enforcement subcommittee,
pursue relief through the circuit court,
or consideration of the formation
of a charter enforcement tribunal
or similar body to ensure compliance with the charter.
I will leave that up to you, Mr. Schroeder, to come up
with an idea or tell me I'm out of my mind
and to move on.
So you have all of those options.
I would consider that other, she's out of her mind.
Option C. It's all on the table. Thank you.
Okay. Thank you. Is that a part of,
that's, that's, that's part of my motion.
Okay.
I will accept that amendment with option C to be
Included. Thank you.
Uh, I will
call the question.
Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lty? Yes. Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey?
Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee? Yes. Rogan C is? Yes.
Motion carries. Next item. Next item is 13.
A request of the 37th District Court
for an increase in budgeted revenues
and appropriations in the amount of $400,000
to amount account for the receipt
of a grant from the Substance abuse
and Mental Health Services Administration, counsel,
consideration and adoption of a resolution.
Motion to approve with discussion,
support, discussion.
Ms. Moore? I, uh, just want to, uh, mention
that this is just a pass through of the grant money
and we're just accepting that money,
we're not spending anything.
So that's it. We need five votes. Any other discussion? No.
Hearing and seeing none. I'll call the question. Ms. Moore?
Yes. Mr. Newnan? Yes. Uh, let's see. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Ms. McGee? Yes.
Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 13 B.
Notice of appointment of Jason Spiller as the Director
of Parks and Recreation. So moved.
Support Lafferty
Discussion.
No discussion from me. No, no.
I interview so good. I'm good.
Mr. Spiller is here.
If you want to allow him to, uh,
introduce himself real fast. Sure.
Sure.
Thank you. At Distinguished Families Council, uh,
my name is Jason Spo.
Uh, I've been in Parks Recreation for past 25 years,
serving, uh, many communities around the, uh,
metro Detroit area.
Uh, I'm very, uh, honored to be, uh, appointed to this role.
I really look forward to, uh, uh, helping out the city, uh,
establish a well-rounded recreation program for all
four quadrants of the city to really enjoy in the future.
And I'm looking forward to working with each
and every one of you, uh, to make this happen.
Thank you. Thank you. Welcome.
We don't really have to approve you, but we'll receive
and file your appointment.
Thank you so much. Thank you. Uh, let's see.
I will call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yep. Ms. McGee?
Yes. Rogan C is? Yes. Thank you very much. Next item.
Next item is 13 C.
Request to review
and confirm the appointment of James Van Verma
to the Construction Board of Appeals for a term
to expire June 30th, 2028.
So moved with discussion
Support Lafferty with discussion.
Discussion. Ms. Moore. Thank Mr. Lafferty. Thank you.
Uh, Mr. Van Verma was the former city engineer
who did a fabulous job.
Uh, he's, uh, also involved on the symphony board
of directors at this time.
Uh, and, uh, Jonathan and I both serve on that, uh, board.
Um, he is highly, highly qualified
and we're lucky to have him on this board,
so I wholeheartedly approve of his appointment.
Thank you. Mr. Lamberty.
Thank you. I just wanted to make it clear. Mr. Ha.
Van Verma, I received my pacer map.
Thank you very much. Old days.
Great. Any other discussion? Hearing and seeing none?
I'll call the question. Ms. Moore? Yes. Mr. Lafferty? Yes.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. Mr. Bokey? Yes. Mr. Nunan? Yes. Ms. McGee?
Yes. Rogan C is a yes. Motion carries. Next item.
Next item is 14.
Audience participation regarding general topics.
Members of the audience who would like
to address the city council this evening may do so
by filling out an audience form located on
the right side of the stage.
This is a reminder, um, that you have three minutes.
This is for general audience only.
Sorry, general audience so you can talk about anything.
First up is Cheryl Akers and after Cheryl is Lori Harris.
Good evening. My name is Cheryl Aker.
I have emailed each one of you regarding
construction on in My Neighborhood on the Roads.
I do appreciate everybody that responded to me.
I do appreciate Jonathan Lafferty for taking the initiative
to come out and actually see what we were talking about.
Um, I understand that with improvement comes inconvenience
and I think our neighborhood has done a good job dealing
with constant dusting of our homes
and vehicles, rearranging our parking issues, roads
that are almost undrivable, which was some kind
of somehow addressed when you guys got my email.
But now they're back to being the way they were before.
Unfortunately, our water being turned off without notice
and frequent blockage of both ends of the block due
to construction workers.
I do want to acknowledge the professionalism of the city
of Warren and Water Department
and Consumers Energy when they were
in our neighborhood working.
They were respectful of the fact that this is a neighborhood
and did a good job, um,
not blocking the driving side of the street.
And when they were finished with their work,
they actually filled in the holes so that it was safe
for kids and vehicles to be around,
Unlike the construction company that we're dealing with.
Now, my main reason for being here is something
that was said to us by a couple of City of Warren workers.
Um, we were told the plan is
to totally close down our street both ends,
um, or maybe do just one half of the block at a time.
Um, and that this would take about three weeks
per half a block, um,
or more depending on the situation.
Um, How can this happen?
You know, we have, on our street alone, we have 50 ve uh,
50 vehicles that our neighbors drive to and from work.
Um, we have people who work every day.
So we can pay our, our bills, which include our city taxes.
And now we're gonna have to walk in the cold, in the dark,
possible rain or snow for at least a block, if not more,
to get to our vehicles.
We'll have our vehicles exposed to the po exposed
to the possibility of additional theft
and damage by leaving them so far away from our homes.
We don't have the opportunity to monitor them.
Um, we have families that have children
that have special health needs
and we have elderly people on our block that have used EMS
to take them to the hospital.
But if our road is closed, how is the EMS people gonna,
how's the emergency vehicles going to even get to them?
How am I going to get my groceries home?
You know, I mean, these are all questions that I have.
You're at your three minutes. Thank you.
Really? Yes. It's a three minutes. Sorry.
Next is Gloria Harris.
After Ms. Harris is Patrick Sims,
It doesn't look like you stay there.
Debbie left.
Hi. I have, uh, several questions.
Um, but first I wanna point out
that the a DA meeting last week was
recorded by communications.
And I did ask Ms. Clayton, Clayton Clayton, uh,
tonight why my comments were cut out of that video.
And my understanding is that's illegal
to take an open meeting and edit the video.
She was completely unaware and said she would check into it,
but how could she be unaware?
Um, I also wanted to comment about the senior Mingle
that's being held at the Warren Community Center.
And I think this is pretty outrageous that
just a gathering from 10 to one two times a week, you have
to be a member of the community center to come
or you can pay a $10 daily pass.
So if you're just gonna be in a room, I mean,
this is a community center.
People can go to the library, people can go
to the historical thing people can look at at the
artwork in the hallways.
But when I asked why this is being set up this way, it was
for the safety of the community center.
We get to walk in the community center.
What would be wrong with just having a room open
and letting people mingle?
I mean, it doesn't, it's not implying
that there's any activity other than just hanging out.
And I think this is ridiculous to charge $10 a day
for a one day pass to come in and just sit and mingle.
Um, I don't know what the other, uh,
the reasoning is for that.
I also wanted to ask, uh, did Mr.
Oosh pay up his fines
because it should be almost a month since he got notified.
And, um, if he hasn't paid them,
I'd like him removed from the Senior Housing Commission.
And I also needed to clarify that Mr.
Elli informed me that I misspoke earlier
that it is the water building, water Department building,
that it also leases the top floor, uh,
to an engineering company.
So there are a lot, there are a lot of people going in
and out and that the kitchen was not going to be done
with a DA funds.
Um, it wasn't really clear to me
how much of the inside bathrooms were done with a DA funds.
Um, but I think it's really important
that we clarify these things
and make sure the right information gets out
because the information
provided suggested this was all the A DA funds.
Um, and those are my comments. Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you Ms. Harris.
Um, I don't think there, is there a Patrick Sims still here?
I don't think so. Ms. Mr. Vander Lin. And you're up.
Joel Vander, Linden. Long time born resident.
I seen a lot of peculiar things here today. Ms.
Barnwell came up here. I thought she spoke very eloquently.
I wondered why the mayor would be doing all
these scenes to her.
And then it dawned on me,
miss Barnwell has accomplished so much in her time here,
at least a hundred times more than the mayor has.
Of course, zero times a hundred.
I I think the truth is, is
that the reason why the mayor's doing this
is a political reason of jealousy
has come this next election when Ms.
Barnal puts her name in for mayor
and she says, I've done this, that, and the other,
and a whole lot more.
What is Ms. Stone going to say?
I made sure you didn't have the proper police department.
I made sure I did everything I could to,
uh, ruin the millage.
I made sure I did everything I could against ya.
I made sure that, uh, the city couldn't protect you.
I let all the good cops go.
It's sad that the mayor's
overreaching now.
I know that each point.
And there was another city I heard about recently
that got rid of their mayor.
The council had enough.
The council stood up and says, we will be pushed no more.
We fight for the people, the people
that elected us in.
We don't hide behind our computers
and eat our uh, fifth meal.
One minute. Mr. Vander Lenin.
Oh, you have a problem with that.
There was some, uh, marijuana issues
that were brought up today.
Ms. Roy, I wanna know why you didn't abstain from voting.
An explanation would be good.
You wanna use your time
For this. I want an explanation.
You can add time back on there.
But I know that you're in a relationship with someone
that's very involved with the marijuana factories
or businesses or something.
And I wanna know why you didn't abstain for voting.
There's now and on any other marijuana item,
Mr. Vander Lin. There's
no conflict. There's no reason for me to
Upset for voting. I see there's
a conflict and I'm a citizen
of war and a voter.
I see a major conflict.
If I see it, the citizen, you're at time
As well. You're
at time and you're free to ask Mr.
Schroer for an additional opinion at some time. 'cause Mr.
Schroer is the one who advised me that there is no conflict.
So, and he is our legal counsel. So have a good night, Mr.
Van Vander Lin. And your time is over. I didn't
Hear your comment. You're,
I said I've been advised legally
that there is no conflict.
Oh, who told you that? Mr. Schroer
Can't make that decision?
Boy, she's a brilliant legal
Mind. Thank you Mr. Vander
Lennon. That is the end of audience.
Next item is response to audience. Madam Chair. Yes.
Just to, um, give Ms. Harris
and anybody else that wants to know,
tomorrow will be 30 days.
If, um, commissioner Oosh
does not pay 5,000 plus dollars that he owes the city,
he will automatically lose his position on the Senior
Housing commission.
That is not a choice of anyone. The mayor can't stop it.
He loses his position.
Also, I have to kinda agree with you on the single
mingle charging.
I can see if you, if there's a cost,
if they're maybe serving food
or something to charge a minimum, um, of $10
and maybe if it's non-residents.
But if it's residents, I hate to see,
uh, them being charged.
But, you know, maybe it's not a huge deal.
But, and I don't know how rates are established.
I don't know. Most rates
and fees in the city are, have to come through council
to approve the fees.
So I'm not sure. Maybe that Parks and Rec is different.
They just pick, they can just do their own fees.
I don't know. Uh, maybe
that's something we'd have to find out.
I don't know if their structure allows them to
it's, and it's possible.
I just don't know. But anyway, those are my comments.
Thank you. Anyone else?
Madam President through the chair.
Mr. Dwyer? Yes. In response to, uh, Ms.
Akers earlier talking about the, uh,
construction on her street, um,
I'm sure they're not gonna be shutting down
the entire street.
There has to be a pathway for emergency response.
So they'll probably, I'm sure, shut down one half
of the street at a time.
So it's not gonna be a situation where
that whole street is gonna be totally closed.
So that's all I have.
Thank you. Thank you. Anything further?
That is the end of council's response to audience.
Motion to adjourn
Support dw.
All in favor? Aye. Aye. Any opposed?
We are adjourned.