It is 3:03, and I'm calling the meeting of DDA to
order. Roll call.
Roll call.
Mr. Vickery, excused. Mr. Jackson, excused. Mr.
Roviris, excused. Mr. Wiegand.
Here.
Mr. Zamora.
Present.
Mr. Petzel.
Here.
Ms. Cavalier.
Present.
Mayor Stone.
Yes.
I have a quorum.
Thank you. Can I get a motion to adopt the agenda?
Excuse the absent members.
Oh, thank you. Can I get a motion to excuse the absent members?
So moved.
Thank you, Tom.
Second?
Support.
Support from Oz. All in favor?
Aye.
Motion carries.
Adoption of agenda.
So moved.
Thank you, Oz.
Support.
Support from Tom.
All in favor?
Aye.
Motion carries.
Audience participation. Anyone who would like to address the body,
please step up.
Light crowd today.
Seeing no takers. Moving on.
A motion for approval of minutes.
I'll make the motion.
Thank you, Oz. Second?
Support.
Support from Michael.
All in favor?
Aye.
Motion carries.
Old business.
Arsenal Alliance consulting agreement.
So
DDA funds the expenditure to cover our
partnership with Sterling Heights.
We know that our defense industry,
hand-in-hand with automotive and manufacturing, is the heart
of what Warren offers, and we know that there are
plenty of communities that would like to compete and/or solicit
our
Detroit Arsenal to come to other
communities. But we know that with our, what, $6.5
billion
investment in defense industry here,
that it is imperative that we remain competitive.
And
just wanted to provide some information.
We went out for an RFP to seek representation,
looking for a partner who would provide a footprint,
web presence,
and the RFP committee selected AECOM Great
Lakes, Inc.
They are economic development advisory partner for the Arsenal Alliance.
They'll be providing a 36-month contract valued at
$1.3 million. So that is that cumulative
over five year.
Warren is on for 250,000.
Sterling Heights meets us at 250,000, and that's a
half million annually.
The focus is on defense industry growth, federal
funding, and workforce development.
Responsibilities include strategic planning, stakeholder
coordination, and implementation support.
AECOM leadership, Detroit-based branding partner
based in Washington, DC,
as part of their federal policy firm with the McKeon Group,
with the overall goal of strengthening the region's
position as a national defense corridor and expanding
opportunities for local businesses and workforce.
Does everyone have this?
Yeah.
Okay.
We passed out,
which is kind of an overview and a little bit of a project
expectations from AECOM
for your review. This is really a receive and file
item.
Mm-hmm.
But we are funding this initiative.
A big portion of our DDA
houses development contractors, and we want to grow that
and retain that, and so this is our
focus on that outcome.
Any questions or discussion? Yes, Gina?
So this is funded with the
contribution to the defense collaborative that we already approved,
right?
Correct. Yes.
Yeah.
Motion to approve.
Motion to approve by Gina.
We fund with about, over the three-year period, it'll be
1.5 million. So there's a little bit of money there in case
we're going to do studies or hire any
further consultant or something. There's a little bit of funding.
The rest of it will be going directly to this group to activate
this.
Yes.
This is an impressive project team.
Yes.
Absolutely. They have a great reputation.
Any other discussion or question before we receive and file?
Support Gina.
So motion to receive and file as-
Motion to receive and file. All in favor?
Aye.
Motion carries.
Thank you.
New business.
Jason Spiller.
We've got some parks and rec items.
Item A, enclosure consulting and structural engineering services from
PSI. Can you give us an overview-
Yes
... of what they're working on?
Thank you, board.
Jason Spiller, parks and rec director.
The recreation center has been experiencing what we think
are leaks, condensation leaks, throughout the whole winterIn
the building.
We figured that we scope the service we thought with the façade of the
building. So we asked for a structural engineer to come in there and
give a structural analysis investigation of the moisture in there.
The scope of services include document review, site investigation,
roofs observation, and infrared scanning
system. Its recommended company for professional services,
industry PSI, which is Intertek company out of Macomb,
Michigan, not to go past
$23,500.
Yeah. So if you'd spent any time over at either the
rec room or the fitness room or the pool, you've gotten a nice
humidity-
Yeah
... throughout the winter-
I'm-
... with some condensation issues.
Yeah. Unfortunately, right now, both the pool and the fitness center are on the
same
HVAC system, which really is a hard thing to do when you have a
pool and you have a fitness center that have two different areas.
So,
we experienced a lot of
leakage during the
bitter colder winters. We know it's condensation. It's not roof leakage.
It was freezing. Obviously, everything was frozen outside.
But it caused a severe leakage in our building, severe
condensation, rust coming down the pool, on the pool
deck, and various things of that factor.
Questions or discussion on this item?
Oz?
I would make the motion to pass this and just make the statement
that whenever you mix athletics and too much
condensation, you could have chances of mold issues
arising. So I think this is money well spent.
Mm-hmm.
Be it for the pool, the gym, or both,
it's money well spent because
one thing will lead to another, and it can snowball into something bigger.
And I think this is good upfront money to get it checked out right away.
Thank you.
Thank you. Gina?
It seems like we recently had something else with
condensation related to the heating and cooling.
I think that was tied to it. I think it was the installation of a temporary
humidifier-
Yeah, we had a temporary humidifier-
... before we call for relief
... go in there for a couple of months. We had to put the temporary in there.
In the interim time before we got the temporary in them, those couple of weeks
was where we experienced-
Mm-hmm
... a real bad thing, the real condensation issues.
They put the temporary one in. They're replacing it with a new one,
actually, next Wednesday, the 8th.
So the temporary's coming out after two months, a new one's coming in on the
8th of
April.
It seems like condensation has been a challenge at that building for a
very long time. Is this a band-aid,
or is this going to get to the root?
Hopefully, with the structural analysis,
I'm trying to get past the band-aids.
Great.
That's what I want to get past.
Band-aids keep coming off, and they keep exposing more wounds.
I'd rather get it fixed the first time, so these band-aids go away, and we don't
have to worry about them in the future.
And I have to say, Jason's been doing a really deep dive
into our parks, into our recreation facilities
to really to get at the heart of what does this look like.
Yes, Councilman Noonan.
Oh, thank you. Yes, Jason. So this is an analysis really only,
but it's a pretty in-depth one regarding the roof,
and using infrared scanning, and visual review of structural components,
exploratory openings to identify concealed deficiencies.
So you'll be looking into the walls and the floors and everything?
Yeah, because we suffered a lot of ice damage or a lot of ice
thing on the
façade of our building, stucco. When you went in the inside, it was
soaking wet from the inside.
It was frozen on the outside, so obviously, we know it's causing is
that the building is trying to keep up with the outside temperatures, and
it can't do it, so it's causing all this moisture to be up there, and then
it's causing it to leak down into our facility.
Through the pool area, it's going through pipes that have rust on them, so it's
showing rust on it. In the fitness area, obviously, you're going
to have water going on top of treadmills, which is a complete hazard-
Mm-hmm
... in safety factors.
Right. Things like black mold.
And that's a big issue because you're having
water come into the fitness room, and a fitness room doesn't have the
same air handling units as a pool that can handle that kind of
attention.
When would the report probably be available to read?
The report?
That they're going to come up with.
Do you have a timeline?
No, I don't actually.
Once we get them on, they said they have a timeline where they can do it.
Let's see.
A timeline.
Oh, the kind of thing of when their timeline they can get this
thing, when they're going to go in there and get it done.
They know that they can do this better now because it's not frozen.
They can see everything now.
I don't know if they've given us an actual time.
They said they'll get started in the next four weeks once we get the approval.
Okay.
So.
So it's going to happen pretty quick.
Yeah. So I would like to
try to get everything in place before we get into next October
and November.
Mm-hmm.
Before we get into what we face this year, try to solve these issues
before we enter into the winter. It seems to only happen in the winter to us.
Yeah.
So I wanted to prepare it now before we go do the thing next year and not have
to suffer what we did this year.
I've noticed when I walk through the community center
that there's a moldiness to the air. I'm really sensitive to that.
So I hope that
it'd be really great if that could all be cleared up-
Yeah
... and it just smell good in there.
Sounds like $23,500 well spent.
Thank you so much.
Thank you. Hopefully, we get a good result and get
bottom-line answers to us.
Okay. Can I get a motion to approve funding for enclosure consulting and
structural engineering services by PSI in the amount of
$23,500?
Motion to approve.
Motion, Oz.
Support.
Support, Gina.
Roll call.
Mr. Zamora?
Yes.
Ms. Cavalier? Mr. Meagan?
Yes.
Mr. Petzel?
Yes.
Mayor Stout?
Yes.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Okay. Tina.
Item B is a request for funding for city building ADA improvement,
priority two from Hubbell, Roth, and Clark.
Tell us about what we've already checked off the list, and what are we looking to
do next?
Sure. Good afternoon. So, priority one for
all the DDA buildings is currently happening now.
The contractor's working on all those items.
And so,
based on our last ADA meeting, we decided to proceed with priority two,
which is in the community center and police headquarters.
It's all on ADA updates, such as
bathrooms. They have it listed here.
On the community center, it's showers, lockers, men's,
women's pool locker,
hot tubs. It's all listed in the packet, what they're going to do in the community
center and then in the police building.
We're chipping away at the list that we-
... yeah, came up with.
Question, Gina?
What makes something a priority two as opposed to a priority
one?
So,
we worked with HRC, the architect.
She explained that resident accessible is
priority one,
and then employee accessible
priority two.
And that's how they... I think they had priority three in-
Well, and it tied back to Federal Title II Act
defined what the different levels of priority for access
were.
So priority two is if it's not a public
area, but it's for-
Employees
... staff, for employees-
Yeah, staff
... in-
I mean, yes
And I guess if it wasn't done,
then would it be the city's obligation to make a reasonable accommodation,
or would the city be required to do it?
How does that work?
I mean, we're required to have a plan to get it done.
That's what we're required to do, and
yes, we would have to make accommodations if we didn't do it.
I'm going to defer to Adriana. We could always send
questions to her. She was quite knowledgeable in-
Yes
... how to handle it.
She's the mastermind behind it.
I guess my real question is, and I fully support doing this
at the community center-
Mm-hmm
... but what's the long-term plan for the police headquarters?
Because this is half a million dollars.
Mm-hmm.
And
if everything around it is going to be refreshed, and
that is a very old building that is really band-aided,
as was said, is there a long-term strategy there?
That's a great question.
Part of that comes down to what finances are we ready to invest.
We recognize that the courts are at end of life,
and arguably, PD was built around the same time, and they're
integral together.
Some of the discussion has been around
does it make sense to plan a court building separate
from the police,
if you know that within the next 10 years you're going to need to build
there? But there's larger discussions that need to be had
on what everyone's ready to move forward with.
Is there any timing plan for those discussions and
decisions?
I'm not sure where we are with that.
I guess as a point of discussion for
everyone, is it appropriate to
put a half million dollars into priority two
items
for a building that
may not be with us for very long?
That's a reasonable question.
I fully support everything being accessible.
Don't get me wrong on that.
Mm-hmm.
But these are not public areas,
and we have not had a request for an accommodation.
Mm-hmm.
We're
just saying.
Some of the items under the community center, though, are public areas, so I'm not
quite sure what is-
I fully support the community center part of it.
Yeah. Okay.
Yeah. The community center, I don't think that anybody's talking about the
community center not being there at any time in the
future.
Yeah. The police building is mostly the second floor
and hardware.
Of the $65,000,
do we know how much is PD specific? How much is-
Yeah, it's on the-
... community center?
Yeah, it's in her proposal. So PD
is $42,075
out of the $65,000.
The community center is $23,380.
But the estimate for the improvement value,
so this is for the design, the estimate for the improvements for the community
center is $200,000. For the police headquarters, it's
$450,000.
Correct. So this is just one portion.
It's broken down into a couple of projects.
Yeah, it's going to be one bid package, though.
For design.
Two buildings. Yeah.
Is there more discussion or questions?
Madam Chair?
Do you want to table it to do further
discussion?
Did you have something to add?
Yes. I'm familiar with the police building, and there are areas that
are accessible to the public, especially the hallway.
And I know it's a heavily
populated floor with a lot of personnel.
I'm not sure about the scope of the actual
locations of the improvements, but I'm sure some are in the hallways.
Most of it's second floor.
Second floor, right. Which is accessed by the public.
Oh, it is? Okay.
Yes, it is.
That's good to know. All right.
Not the back area-
Mm-hmm
... but the hallway.
Well, if this is-
A lot of times, the public does have to come in for interviews.
This is specific to priority two, and our priority two is not the public
areas, because we've put a lot of money into the ADA
upgrades. We've done the priority one upgrades-
Mm-hmm
... at the police department. So is this something
that can be held?
And like I said, I would be happy to move the community center part
forward right now. My question is just,
if there
are discussions about potentially
including the police headquarters in
the downtown plan and somehow looking at that, or
at least planning for it with the court...
Because this part of it is just the
HRC design work. So the design work for the engineering,
doing the specs is $42,000.
Mm-hmm.
But the cost estimate for the improvements is
$450,000.
So if this is not something that is for an
area that is publicly accessible, and we don't have an
employee who has requested an accommodation,
is it something that can be held at least until a decision is
made as-
Mm-hmm
... to the timing and the scope of the project
that we've all been working on and are putting out for bid?
The community center, I think, is a completely different situation.
Everybody's using it. Nobody thinks the community center's going to be torn down.
That's there.
Can we bifurcate PD planning
and community center planning?
Yes, as long as the cost would remain the same, it's not a bundled cost.
If it's-
I think they're separated, yeah
... that, I don't know, because it's based on a percentage, so I'm not-
Yes
... quite sure if it will change. I can have her write a new proposal.
But you were saying the second floor is accessible to the public.
The bathrooms are on the second floor?
There are bathrooms, the hallway, and a lot of times if people are being
interviewed,
at least my understanding-
All right
... is they're brought back into the private areas. There are interview rooms.
Okay. That's true.
They're brought back into the
restricted areas for interviews.
I see.
But I think, Tina, it's not so much, to
Gina's point,
if once in a while the public might
use it. If we're going to tear the building down, do we need to do this?
Oh, I know. I understand.
And so I think that that conversation between council and
administration needs to be had-
Sure
... before we're
kind of fixing things that maybe could wait a little bit.
Sure.
I think that's the question.
Yeah. No, I agree. But I can have her rewrite the proposal with just-
Well, she separated community center as $23,380, and the police
headquarters is $42,075. So we could
just approve the-
We want to move forward just with community center?
... community center.
At this time?
I'm open.
But... Okay.
The percentages might change, though, because they're on a curve,
and the smaller the project, the higher the percentages.
So that's-
Gotcha
... how it works.
So you can just prepare?
Yeah. I can resubmit something that has only community
center priority two.
Would it be helpful if we made a motion to approve the community center
portion of the project up to $25,000?
Oh yeah. Even if it changes a little bit, we could do that, yeah.
Up to?
Because it's not going to be a big difference. Yeah.
Yeah.
I'm okay with that, if that's a motion.
Can you repeat that?
Motion to approve the community center portion of the project
up to $25,000,
and
it would be appropriate to include in the motion a
request for some time to facilitate, to have some
conversation about what the long-term strategy is for the
police headquarters.
Okay.
Can I get a support?
I'll support that.
Thank you, Tom.
Ron Call.
Ms. Gallagher?
Yes.
Mr. Wiegand?
Mr. Patzelt? Yes. Mr. Zamora?
Yes.
Mayor Stow.
Yes.
Thank you.
Okay. Thank you.
Jeff, elevators.
Or item C is a request for funding to make
repairs to existing car number three elevator in the parking
garage by TK Elevator. Can you tell us what are some of the
issues we're encountering, and which car is it?
Is it the one right here outside the main building or closer to the courts?
The northeast-
Okay
... corner closest to the court. And no doubt we've had a brutal
winter, and it causes a lot of damage.
So there was a roof drain that came separated from the drain pipe
that sits right next to the elevator, and that happened over a
weekend. And once it separated,
it rained inside of the elevator and caused all the damage.
And so we're asking to get that repaired, but also
asking for 50% down payment,
to get the project started.
Okay. Questions or discussion on this item?
So obviously the water damage will be taken care of first and then the repairs to
the elevator. Is that what I'm reading here?
Yeah. So we already repaired the pipe-
Okay
... and secured everything, so no more leakage
is going to take place. We put what we call a hanger
to secure that pipe-
Mm-hmm
... into the roof drain, and so it cannot move.
And so what happened was, because we get snow and ice, and
then rain, then warm weather, cold weather, then
frost, and because there was no hanger, the pipe was able
to move.
So now it's stable and it cannot move.
Thank you.
Mm-hmm.
Question.
Yes, Councilman?
Yes. This damage caused by
water damage, is that subject to an insurance claim?
That, because the city is self-insured, so that I don't know.
The-
If it-
The repairs don't meet... We have a minimum of 1.5?
$100,000 deductible.
Gotcha.
And what was the cost here?
$94,230.
So we're liable for it.
Yes.
And this was not the elevator
that was damaged last time, but this is the other elevator, correct?
Yeah. This is the one-
You're before us just recently.
No.
Like everything else around here, buildings are getting old.
Mm-hmm.
Are there plans to replace the elevators,
or are they sound operating condition for many years
yet, or?
This cost, we're getting a new elevator with this cost.
And also in year 2028,
the state mandates certain changes have to be made, and
with this cost, those changes will be made, so we're getting a new elevator.
So you're ahead of the game.
We're ahead of the game.
Good deal.
Yeah.
If I remember, DDA authorized funding the replacement of all the
elevators here at Civic Center, and then
court if needed-
Mm-hmm
... in order to meet that compliance deadline.
Correct.
Within the last year.
Yes.
Okay.
Any other questions or discussion on this item?
Motion to approve.
Thank you, Gina.
Support.
Support from Tom. Roll call.
Ms. Cavalier.
Yes.
Mr. Patzelt. Yes. Mr. Wigan.
Yes.
Mr. Zamora.
Yes.
Mayor Stow.
Yes.
Thank you.
Are you covering the PD item-
Yes
... as well? Okay. Thank you. Item D, request for funding
for Police Department handicap door operating repair from
Great Lakes Security Hardware.
Yes.
What do we have going on at PD? I know we're doing the
upgrade on the
patio-
The plaza
... facade. Yeah.
Yeah. On the plaza.
Plaza.
But this particular door, the door operator
has stopped working,
and it's one of the original door operators, so it's quite
old. But we've done all we can to maintain it, and this is the door that
has to be accessible-
Mm-hmm
... for individuals. And that's the only door on the east side of the
police station where the ramps are at, where someone can actually enter
inside the PD who need an accessible door.
And so we're just asking to replace that door operator, so that door
can operate properly.
Thank you. Any questions or discussion on this item?
Motion to approve.
Thank you, Tom.
Support.
Support by Oz. Roll call.
Mr. Patzelt. Yes. Mr. Zamora.
Yes.
Ms. Cavalier.
Yes.
Mr. Wigan.
Yes.
Mayor Stow.
Yes.
Thank you.
Thank you. And then Rick Fox and Mark Knapp are joining us today,
and we're
adopting the fiscal 2026 DDA budget, which did not
occur.
So would you like to speak to that item?
You were out on medical last year.
Yes.
Yeah.
Thank you, Madam Chair, members.
So yeah, so we got some housekeeping items to take care of.
So the council adopted the fiscal '26 budget,
and so that item needs to be approved by this board.
Also
in the budget,
the council also made some amendments, reappropriation.
So items that weren't completed at the end of the
last fiscal year,
the council approved the reappropriations to be able to spend in
this fiscal year, and this board needs to approve
those. And then also in the approved budget was the
DDA electing to refrain from utilizing Act 345
millageAnd
that item is as part of this resolution.
That's the three items.
And I'll answer any questions you may have.
Questions?
Could we get an explanation of what Act
345 millage is?
Yes.
Yep.
So Act 345 millage is to cover police and fire
pension and healthcare costs.
That's exactly what it does.
And so I'll give you a little history.
So three years ago, we had a law firm challenge
the city, not just the city of Warren, but throughout the whole state that had Act
345 millages, and challenged whether or not we could
actually charge healthcare. They didn't have a problem with the
pensions. It was a healthcare issue that came to play.
And so back three years ago, we weren't really
charging a very minor amount of healthcare to
the millage.
And,
so the auditors have brought it up to us, basically stating that
the city could
also charge the healthcare part to that Act
345 millage. So we started doing that.
So
three years ago, we put in
for the DDA to refrain from collecting the Act 345 to
help fund the offset to the police and fire millage
for
pensions and healthcare. And so that's in this year's budget again, and
then it'll also be in the proposed budget for
the next fiscal year.
Madam
Chair?
Yes, Councilman Noonan.
You're done, right?
What's that?
You were done with your question, right?
Yeah.
Okay. So I noticed that under fund balance
appropriated,
the original budget had
$5,523,000
and $353. I
haven't read off dollars in that big of figures lately, but...
And then the amended budget
was more than twice that much, considerably more than twice that
much,
$14,755,310.
So,
I'm not that familiar with how this works.
I'm sure it's all up and up and everything.
So-
But that just means that we spent a lot more money than we budgeted for?
No, so what happens is, so
you approve certain line items. You're going to fix the police station, you're
going to do some roadwork around the area
here, and the work doesn't get done by June 30th. So that's our fiscal year.
So what we do then is we reappropriate it and bring it into
the next fiscal year.
Right.
And so that's what those amendments are, are items that were approved
in the budget by the council-
Okay
... and then didn't get completed by June 30th.
And so then Mark will then go through and go through all the items and then
reappropriate those items into the next fiscal year.
So we can expect that same thing to happen in next year's budget.
Yes. I would expect there'll be-
That quite a lot of money won't have been spent yet-
Yes
... and it'll be rolled over into the next year.
Yes.
Okay, so there's nothing much to be found in that.
No.
I'm looking for anything I can find. Something to bite on here.
Okay.
I yield.
Madam Chair.
Thank you. Yes, Councilman Boyke.
The results of that lawsuit, for 345, what
was the result?
So-
Can you tax that?
So what the results were that
the city
and all the cities that were impacted could charge the
healthcare portion to that Act 345 millage.
So the Act 345 millage is in the general fund.
And so if we didn't pick up that money from the DDA,
that'd be a 1.7 million,
probably a little more, but right around there, 1.7 million
that we'd have to figure out how to balance.
And the budgets have been getting tough the past three years, and
they're probably going to be tough for the next
few years. But that's why we were taking the money out of the DDA and putting
it into the general fund to cover that police and fire pension and healthcare.
Okay. And the properties affected by the DDA, they paid a
millage rate,
whatever they're assessed.
Within the DDA?
Correct.
Yes.
And that goes to DDA, so it's only makes sense that that
money be moved over to the general fund.
Well, if it doesn't, then you're going to have to figure out how we're going to
balance the budget.
Because that's what it was earmarked as in the millage.
That's correct.
And I-
So what needs to happen is, that's why we have to come over to the
DDA board, get approval to have that money transferred over to the general
fund, in which you have the prior year.
When you adopt this budget,
we hope that you do it again. We hope that the DDA passes that again.
And that's what our auditors are telling us, too, as far as compliance, correct?
Well, exactly. The auditors have basically advised us
to take advantage of the fact that they
can pay for the healthcare costs. So just an example, in
the general fund, that's about $27 million.
So it's not a minor amount.
So where we're at now, you're asking the board to pass that in order to
transfer it-
Yes
... over.
And that's up to the board.
That's correct.
Okay. Thank you very much. I yield back.
You're welcome.
Statutorily, we have an obligation to uphold our contracts
and pensions for retirement for police and fire.
We have to maintain at least a 60%
funding of that, and we're at about 62%
currently.
Yeah, right around there. Yep.
And expenses are not going down when it comes to pensions and healthcare for
police and fire.
Unfortunately not.
Gina?
So when the DDA plan was
approved, this was a millage in place-
Correct
... already, and it was not excluded from-
No
... the capture.
You're right.
And
I know that I have some-
Okay
... yeah, potential privileged information
here in front of me, but as a volunteer, I find myself in a
very challenging spot that
there are conflicting opinions about whether or not this is
something that is appropriate for this board to
move forward with.
So I'm
a little bit confused.
Do we have any guidance as to eligibility of funding?
So
we have to cover this 1.7 for
police and fire regardless.
Let-
It's either coming out of general fund-
Right
... or millage.
So let me just add, so when we did this, at the time,
John Axe was our bond council financial advisor.
So he prepared the resolution that the board approved,
which is legal,
and the board approved it to have those monies go to the general fund.
So our current bond counsel,
Ron Liscomb, is of the same opinion that
as long as the resolution's approved by the board to have the monies
get back to the general fund,
it's perfectly legal.
So, and Mary, because I don't think that the question is,
does the general fund need the money, or do we need to pay police and fire
healthcare? The question that I have is, is this a
legal action-
Is this eligible? Yeah
... this body has the authority to
approve?
Rick,
would it be appropriate for
the DDA to get
either a legal opinion from bond counsel or an attorney-
Oh, absolutely
... legal opinion?
No,
it doesn't have to be-
We're in a tough spot here.
No, I agree. I agree.
It can wait until the next... You can exclude that portion and...
Well, it can just all be done at the same meeting.
So I could have Ron be at the next DDA meeting and
lay that out for you.
Maybe we can even have a closed session-
Closed session
... to consult with-
Legal
... counsel.
Good.
I got no-
Madam Chair
... problem with that.
Just to emphasize a little bit more on that,
you got taxpayers paying the millage that's going to DDA.
And if that money's not earmarked for the millage, and it
stays in DDA, and DDA spends it on something else, are we
opening ourselves up to a potential lawsuit
if there's a... Why not?
To-
Well, we're not, because-
They're paying for something
... we couldn't-
But this isn't a discussion. This is...
You can-
Well, I think-
I asked why not. That's all I said
... pose a question.
So I think I can answer that because-
And I was being interrupted for an answer. I was still talking.
Well, I didn't say anything. I just shook my head, and you asked me that.
Let's... Okay, point of order, Councilman.
Yes.
You have the floor.
Yes, I do. And my concern is that we're opening up ourselves
to liability if that money's not...
If it's supposed to be earmarked for a pension and healthcare for
retirees,
and you have a taxpayer paying into the DDA, that
assessment's on his tax rolls, and it's not going to
that. What recourse could a taxpayer have?
Madam Chair.
And that's my question, too, I imagine to city attorney or legal minds,
because I'm not a lawyer.
And I appreciate you raising that. Rick, did you want to speak to that?
Yeah, just my review with our bond counsel,
both bond counsels,
it's not illegal for the DDA to capture the dollars.
Correct.
Okay.
That's why we have the resolution saying that the board approves it to
go to the general fund to help offset the pension
cost.
So I don't think we could have an issue with the taxpayer bringing
that up because the DDA does have a right to capture the dollars.
The real question becomes is, how do we completely fund the police and
fire pensions without this transfer?
And that's why we went to the board two years ago, and it got approved, where it's
in the current budget that we need approved.
And going forward, it probably
won't be included in the revenue of the DDA because
we need the dollars to capture in the general fund in order to
balance the general fund.
Madam Chair?
Yes.
I agree with you, Mr. Fox, on that, but
my question is,
if the board doesn't transfer that money-
Well, then-
... does that pose a problem then? That's what I'm talking about.
I think you're asking two questions.
I know if the board passes it and it goes over, it's a mute question.
Well,
just in the past, if the council has the
ultimate authority over the budget of the DDA,
and so in the past when the council I
know want the dollars, I'm sure the mayor wants the dollars to be able to go to
the general fund in order to fund the police and fire pension and help
the general fund balance its budget.
If it's not, if the DDA doesn't approve it, then it just gets into
a situation where the council can take some actions that
probably the DDA board wouldn't like.
And I don't think any of us want to get into that, so-
Let me
make a comment, and then I'll defer to you, Gina.
Perhaps put myself into your shoes.
As controller,
we have the priorities that we have to fund as a city, and then we
haveWhat we have flexibility on
where we allocate funds after that.
We know that general fund dollars are tight, and
we're up against
what we're expending.
Okay.
We have a requirement to fund this, and
often DDA funds projects over and above
what we have.
So it sounds to me like the recommendation is
funding the police and fire retirement out
of this-
Mm-hmm
... and then using what is the balance to fund additional
capital outlay, equipment,
economic
revenue, generating opportunities
would be the priorities.
Do you want to add to that, Gina?
My question isn't does the general fund need the money.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, obviously the general fund needs the money.
Mm-hmm.
My question is, is this a
transfer that
this DDA or any DDA has the
authority to do? The DDA is capturing millages
all across, and they're capturing the library millage.
They're capturing all the county millage.
So
do we have the authority to say, "Well, we're going to give this part
back," because it's
kind of funding something that...
And also it's kind of the devil is in the detail.
If this is approved, how
does it get recorded? What is the
documentation of the transaction?
Is it a
funding of police and fire pension?
Is it foregoing the
millage?
Like I said, I'm open-minded about this-
Mm-hmm
... but I have before me conflicting
recommendations from members of your administration.
Mm-hmm.
So I would say we-
Who is our subject matter expert that we bring in for-
At the-
... that type of thing?
... next meeting, I can have our bond counsel come in,
and he can write up a prior legal opinion, get it to you before the meeting so you
can review it, and then we can
decide at that point.
No, and-
That'd be great. I think that the opinion is that they want to help the city.
It's the whole point of the DDA. But there's been some...
When I asked Mr. Lipscomb, is it?
He was to send me something that would justify that, and I never got
it. And when I asked Mary, her opinion wasn't quite the same
as what his might have been. So if we could bring him
here, that would be a big help.
Yeah. No problem.
Mayor?
Mm-hmm.
The purpose of the DDA isn't to help the city general fund.
Correct.
The purpose of the DDA is to reinvest in the DDA district
to advance the goals of the plan
and
for the benefit of the entire-
Mm-hmm
... city. It's not to help the general fund.
Correct.
And so
I
feel an obligation to understand that
this is something that is,
whether or not you want to do it or you think you like doing it,
that really is not the point here. It's is this legal?
Mm-hmm.
And does this body have the authority to do it,
and technically, how do we approve it
and memorialize it?
Mm-hmm.
So I'm hearing let's table this
and have someone bring some additional subject matter
expert opinion?
Yes.
Does it take a motion?
Motion to table?
Correct, yes.
Motion to table.
Thank you, Gina.
Support that.
Support from Tom.
I'll be rolling along.
Is this some
movement?
Roll call, please.
Roll call, or can I move it?
You did not. Do you need the roll call?
All in favor?
Okay.
Aye.
Thank you.
Very good.
Okay, this item is tabled.
Until the next meeting, or?
Yes. We'll gather some additional information.
Thank you for that.
Item eight, approval of the list of bills.
Question or discussion on this item?
Madam Chair?
Yes, Councilman.
The Eckstein Park restroom renovations,
is that park in the DDA area?
Tom, can you speak to the-
It doesn't say
... the footprint?
Yes.
Or Mary?
It's DDA.
It's under the DDA? Okay.
Yes, it is.
Thank you. You'll get it.
Thank you.
Any other questions?
I have a question.
Yes.
Just a clarification that the improvements list of bills, which that
will also... A final list of bills will also include that
$50,000, is that correct?
Yes. The down payment on the elevator.
Yes, so this list of bills will be plus that 40-
Yes
... some thousand for the elevator down payment.
Thanks, Mayor.
Motion to pay the bills.
Thank you, Al.
Support.
Support from Tom.
Mr. Zamora?
Yes.
Mr. Petzel?
Yes.
Mr. Wiegand?
Ms. Cavalier.
Yes.
Mayor Stone.
Yes.
The bills get paid.
Thank you.
Good of the order.
Anyone have announcements from around town?
I actually got a couple.
Yes.
On May 19th at the main library here at the
center,
Lance Parrish and Tom Gage
will both be there for a question and answer session, but it does
require pre-registration. I believe that starts at 6:00 p.m., so
I would contact the library for further information
about that. And also, if you happen to go by the
community center, outside the historic gallery, there's a real
nice 250th celebration of
the birthday of America outside the historic gallery in the two
hallway showcases that you should see.
Absolutely.
We have a lot going on around town. Our Eight Mile Boulevard
Association is doing their cleanup Monday,
April 13th, Saturday, April 18th.
If anyone would like to join our community partners,
you can sign up online.
Empowering Civic Engagement will be focused on building department.
Lots of interesting information to find out.
That will be April 23rd. If anyone's interested, reach out and
sign up. We are doing our own citywide spring
cleanup. The last couple years, our focus has been on parks and
recreation. The determination was our maintenance
team is killing it in the parks, and people felt
underutilized, and so there was an ask to focus on major
mile roads and half-mile roads, and to put a fresh face
as the snow has melted, and make sure our
community is on display at its best.
So if any community members would like to join us in a citywide cleanup,
Saturday, April 25th, please contact the mayor's office
to join.
Macomb Community College Career
Services virtual job fair will be taking place Wednesday, April
29th.
And I believe, are we one of the sponsors as a city?
Yes.
I know traditionally we have. Yeah.
So if anyone would like more information, my monthly check-in,
it will be April 30th. I had to miss March.
I was under the weather, so I'm looking forward to catching up.
Asian American and Pacific Islander celebration will
take place Saturday, May 2nd at the community
center. We already have, I think, 30-plus
vendors, artists, musicians,
dancers, all kinds of things going on.
That'll be a good time. And Restaurant Week is coming up,
April 10th through 19th. We have over 30 participants.
33.
33. So all kinds of special deals for anyone who would like to check
out
a restaurant around town. Come and support local small
businesses, Ales and Eddies, Mosami's Shawarma, their new
business in town, Andiamo, is a staple.
Buddy Jane's, Beyond Juice,
Buddy's Pizza, Buffalo Wild Wings, City Burger,
some new business, Craven.
Go online, check it out. You can eat somewhere
every meal for a week.
That's right.
For 10 days. I think that covers it.
All right.
Did I miss anything?
What does Garden Club have lined up?
All kinds of stuff.
Next meeting, April 8th.
Daffodils Detroit luncheon, April 15th.
Pruning workshop. Everyone's ready to get their hands in the dirt.
Yes.
Gina.
If any parents are looking for something fun to do with the kids tomorrow,
FIRST Robotics is at Troy Athens.
Nice.
And so four teams will be there, including team
H1A.
Nice.
It's something that is definitely fun for
kids to be able to go and walk through the areas where the kids are working.
It's a great opportunity.
It is entertaining, and it's hands-on, and you get to talk
with the participants firsthand and see how they're taking
classroom applications and putting into real-life work.
It's a great group of kids.
Fantastic.
Anything else happen around town?
Seeing none, our next DDA regular meeting is scheduled for
Wednesday, May 6th,
3:00 p.m. back here. And can I get a motion for adjournment?
So moved.
Thanks, Tom. All in favor?
Aye.
Meeting's adjourned.